AFL Rd 9 2024 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs Melbourne

[madbluboy]

Agree with everything else Kruddler said.

[kruddler]

I am not sure where you find Marchbank and Martin are being rested they have being rested for 5-6 years.

You are comparing players that will be lucky to get 10 games out of them per season to 200+ game players over the age of 30

The point is, why do we play players until we break them.
Yes, some are more fragile then others.
Some are taller than others.
Some are faster than others.
Some are stronger than others.

Find out the attributes of the player and play to their advantages and cover their weaknesses.
If a weakness is their longevity, or durability, cover for it. Rest them when you need too.

Both Martin and Marchbank are very good players when they are fit....we just don't see it enough. So rather than keep doing the same thing and expecting different results, change the way we approach them......and everyone.

Doesn't have to be limited to them. Many on here were suggesting we rest cripps a couple years ago when he was clearly injured. But the club kept insisting everything was fine, and we got a half-fit cripps for the whole year, rather than being without him for 2-3.....7 weeks or whatever it needed to be to get him back to a 'fit' level where he could perform.

I've heard Marc Murphy talk about this, and its something he didn't realise until later in his career.
Players would have surgery as a 1st call to 'fix' something if it meant they could play a week earlier than had they simply sat out and rested. These surgeries can lead to further issues down the track and potentially do more harm than good in some instances.
We are obsessed with getting back and playing THIS WEEK at the expense of next week, next month or next year. Why?

As mentioned, Geelong are leading the pack in this regard. Resting Danger, Hawkins, Cameron, Selwood......hard to find some bigger names in the comp than them, but they find a way to rest them and do ok......most likely because they rest them is why they do ok. So why do we think we know better than them?

Be smarter with how we deal with our players, our seasons depend on it!

[pinot]

Fair points tbh.
Prefer a ruthless approach and replace them with good durable players in aim to build synergy and connection between the lines.
Elijah Hollands + Blake Acres are perfect examples while not superstars maintaining match fitness and connection is super critical in todays game.. top end talent helps but not critical
For example I would replace both with Josh Battle and Will Hayward - they are reliable and durable and greater chance to build connection between the lines on training track than these blokes

[DJC]

The point is, why do we play players until we break them.
Yes, some are more fragile then others.
Some are taller than others.
Some are faster than others.
Some are stronger than others.

Find out the attributes of the player and play to their advantages and cover their weaknesses.
If a weakness is their longevity, or durability, cover for it. Rest them when you need too.

Both Martin and Marchbank are very good players when they are fit....we just don't see it enough. So rather than keep doing the same thing and expecting different results, change the way we approach them......and everyone.

Doesn't have to be limited to them. Many on here were suggesting we rest cripps a couple years ago when he was clearly injured. But the club kept insisting everything was fine, and we got a half-fit cripps for the whole year, rather than being without him for 2-3.....7 weeks or whatever it needed to be to get him back to a 'fit' level where he could perform.

I've heard Marc Murphy talk about this, and its something he didn't realise until later in his career.
Players would have surgery as a 1st call to 'fix' something if it meant they could play a week earlier than had they simply sat out and rested. These surgeries can lead to further issues down the track and potentially do more harm than good in some instances.
We are obsessed with getting back and playing THIS WEEK at the expense of next week, next month or next year. Why?

As mentioned, Geelong are leading the pack in this regard. Resting Danger, Hawkins, Cameron, Selwood......hard to find some bigger names in the comp than them, but they find a way to rest them and do ok......most likely because they rest them is why they do ok. So why do we think we know better than them?

Be smarter with how we deal with our players, our seasons depend on it!

That’s all true … but hard to put into practice when a lot of first choice players are out injured.

Geelong has enjoyed an almost injury free season and they can happily rest or freshen up players as necessary.

For whatever reason, we’ve ended up with some very good players who aren’t very durable.  That limits our ability to (a) win games and (b) give our elite core group an opportunity to refresh.

[kruddler]

That’s all true … but hard to put into practice when a lot of first choice players are out injured.

Geelong has enjoyed an almost injury free season and they can happily rest or freshen up players as necessary.

Chicken and egg though.

Are geelong injury free because they rest?

Are we full of injuries because we don't?

Sure there is some colision injuries.
Sure there is some 'dumb luck' injuries.

But the more fatigued you are, the more likely you are to get injured. Facts.

[pinot]

I am sure Sam Menegola and Sam Simpson will be pleased to hear that Geelong prefer to rest players with 5-6 years history of soft tissue injury rather than delist

[Macca37]

Unlike a team such as Geelong resting its senior players when they are showing signs of tiredness or weariness after a number of hard games, the Carlton experience of recent years is that the likes of Martin, Marchbank and McGovern suffer long term injuries before they get enough game time to warrant being rested.

[DJC]

Chicken and egg though.

Are geelong injury free because they rest?

Are we full of injuries because we don't?

Sure there is some colision injuries.
Sure there is some 'dumb luck' injuries.

But the more fatigued you are, the more likely you are to get injured. Facts.

You can’t rest players who can’t get on the park.

The fact is that we have six senior players who are out injured more often than not.  Then there’s the usual run of injuries that most clubs experience.

Replace most or all of those six injury prone players and we could be in a position to better manage the workloads of Cripps, Walsh, McKay, Curnow, Weitering, Newman and the newbies.

[kruddler]

OK, let me use real world examples to help push the point across.

Zac Williams. Long injury history.
2 weeks ago he was injured in the game and subbed out.
He was picked last week.
He got injured again.
Now vossy is saying he'll be right for this week.

Why?

We keep pushing and pushing and we'll eventually break him again. You could argue that if we rested him last week the result would've been different. Do we need to say the same thing after this week?
Rest him!

[pinot]

ZW should be on the trade table along with a pick. Maybe Bulldogs are stupid enough to bite considering they paid 3rd round for Coffield. Injury prone players with a long history are an avoid.

It is no secret the club needs to rebuild its depth because time is approaching fast to rest senior players periodically. But we havent got any 200 game 30 year olds yet.