Post Game Passion AFL Rd 10: Carlton vs St Kilda

[capcom]

We need to run that poll again.

[shawny]

It's interesting, fans wanted Simmo back like he was a miracle cure, yesterday he was obviously the disease!

Agree.

Same applies for 3/4s of our list, when blokes are injured we use them as an excuse, when they are back in and don't perform as the savior we though they were, we demand they are dropped for the bloke in the 2s who all of sudden looks amazing and is unfairly not getting a game. :

ITs ground hog day.

Our list build is out of balance way too many kids and a gapping hole of senior reliable players in the 70-120 game category. SOS is the man that should be in the gun more then anyone IMO.

Don't care of the excuses why he couldn't attract these sorts...the fact is he couldn't get them in the door and we are suffering bigtime as a result. That is the very reason Brisbane's rebuild is so far ahead of ours.

It was his job and he failed badly.

[Zed]

Rumour has it that the Adelaide Football Club is about to strike a Memorial Plaque in honour of the significant gift they're soon to receive from the Carlton Football Club - the number 1 draft pick in the 2019 draft.

As if giving them Eddie wasn't enough. Does our generosity know no bounds?

>

: We need to stop focusing on this as its not that much of an issue in the scheme of things.
Betts wanted to leave for Adelaide - we didn't give him away. 
Yes losing Pick 1 next year hurts a little bit but Stocker will be very good, is already in the system and we still get their first rounder. 
And surely we have won out in both the Menzel and Gibbs trades?

I'd be more concerned about our McGovern trade. Could be a while before he starts to show enough to justify what we paid for him and by then he will be headed West. 

As for yesterday, as many have said we looked lost and clueless. Either the game plan is downright awful or it is too complicated for the players to grasp.  And there never seems to be any Plan B when the opposition works us out or shuts us down.  All comes down to coaching which is why something needs to be done ASAP.  Certainly doesn't help when players miss easy targets but correct structure can help with that too.

[Baggers]

I remain astonished that BB can claim 'unified'... you only need look at the players to see there aint no unity or understanding. BB is trying to sell us that you can pick up a turd by the clean end!

[PaulP]

Fair enough
That's action...will it happen?

I hope so.

[bignic]

Just a further comment on that players meeting.

As I said previously, aside from Cripps Simmo and Ed C the rest either lack foot and hand skills, decision making ability, or like Charlie C move in and out of the game, or totally lack the ability to stick a tackle. Walsh will be a star and hopefully will keep playing for our club. Fisher is a waste of space who always, if he gets the ball wants to hand it off and won’t kick. None of them will take responsibility for having a shot at goal even if they are 25 metres out.

Do you had this what are effectively aside from a few, a rabble, yelling at each other and telling a few home truths.

Well, we all saw the result. No improvement.

For those who say we were in the game, let’s be intellectually honest.

How much do you think Geelong would have slaughtered us by if we had played them yesterday performing the same way we did against the Saints.

I defy any player including the captain to provide me with a simple two minute video which clearly and concisely explains precisely what game plan they are supposed to be implementing.

I am prepared to forgive a lot. I went through this sort of drought during the 1950’s and 60’s until Barrasi took us to the top.

So I have been there before.

We have The nucleus of a decent side. Give them a game plan they can follow, hone their skills, and for God’s sake teach them how to
tackle, and above all provide them with a coach who has at least a proven track record, Scott took the kangas to two preliminary finals with a good ordinary team as jack dyer would have called them, and we might actually progress.

[Blue Moon]

We still hear the same old claptrap on this forum, sack the coach, sack the players, sack the President, sack the Board sack the staff, sack the assistant coaches, every deal is a dud, nobody is any good, the world is woeful, everyone is against us, they should have listened to me. What is the alternative.
We have the fundamentals of a very good list, the club is an very good shape off the field, and they have a plan that they are sticking to.
Tell me the alternative, who, what, when, where, how and why. Give me the details.

[WASurfer]

Beat me to it Big Nic. I've been a supporter since 1981 and a member for 25 years but I've just about had enough of this crap getting served up week after week. No disrespect to St Kilda but they're ordinary and yet they made us look stupid at times. Too often they ran it from one end to the other with good disposal and picked off unmarked men in their forward line at will....if they'd kick straight we wouldn't have been anywhere near them. They were missing arguably their best defenders in Carlisle, Roberton and Geary and yet with three key forwards we couldn't hit a target if we tried. Charlie worked hard up the ground and probably his best game for the season but if we're plugging holes in the middle by using him up the ground it defeats the purpose.

You can sugar coat it all you like but we're bottom of the ladder (again), destined for the wooden spoon (again) and this year we won't even have the number 1 pick to look forward to. You're kidding yourself if you think we've progressed in the last 3 years. Our skills are absolutely deplorable and turnovers kill us week after week. If you're brutally honest, there's probably 3 blokes on our list at the moment (excluding Docherty who's out again) that would get a game at another club right now....Cripps, Walsh, McKay.

How many times this year has Dow butchered a shot at goal at key moments in games? I'm sick of hearing about "elite runner", "great endurance" and "breakaway speed" when they talk about draftees. If you can't do the most basic thing in the game, kick the footy, then you can have all the running ability in the world and you'll be good at chasing an opponent and not much else. I hope I'm wrong, but we'll look back in 3 or 4 years on the 2017 draft as another one that we slaughtered.

I was taken with Bolton initially and his youthful enthusiasm and honesty but we've stalled, our young players are not coming on (Walsh excluded) and for the life of me I can't work out our game plan. In defence we're like Richmond of about 6 or 7 years ago where opponents just waited for the poor skills and decision making to eventually show through and they'd turn it over trying to kick short, backwards and sideways. If Thomas and Simpson are all we've got to keep a cool head down back then we're in strife. Newman showed some fight yesterday but even he turned it over numerous times.

Agree with EB's earlier comment about Kreuzer. He's been a warrior for us but he looked tired and cumbersome yesterday against a smaller/inexperienced opponent. Like many, for weeks I was calling for Kennedy to be in there to help Cripps but he showed us exactly why he hasn't been in there....slow and ineffective. Take Cripps and Walsh out of that midfield and at the moment we've got nothing. SPS/Fisher/Dow etc just don't do anywhere near enough. Yes they're young, but so is Walsh...so is Cripps.

This mid-season draft is a free hit of sorts but we're gonna blow another chance with Deluca. There's a reason he only played 4 games in 3 years with Fremantle.....slow and not big enough.

I'm not sure how many more weeks Bolton has got left but another bad loss this week and we need to be put out of our misery.

[Thryleon]

We still hear the same old claptrap on this forum, sack the coach, sack the players, sack the President, sack the Board sack the staff, sack the assistant coaches, every deal is a dud, nobody is any good, the world is woeful, everyone is against us, they should have listened to me. What is the alternative.
We have the fundamentals of a very good list, the club is an very good shape off the field, and they have a plan that they are sticking to.
Tell me the alternative, who, what, when, where, how and why. Give me the details.

This.

Beat me to it Big Nic. I've been a supporter since 1981 and a member for 25 years but I've just about had enough of this crap getting served up week after week. No disrespect to St Kilda but they're ordinary and yet they made us look stupid at times. Too often they ran it from one end to the other with good disposal and picked off unmarked men in their forward line at will....if they'd kick straight we wouldn't have been anywhere near them. They were missing arguably their best defenders in Carlisle, Roberton and Geary and yet with three key forwards we couldn't hit a target if we tried. Charlie worked hard up the ground and probably his best game for the season but if we're plugging holes in the middle by using him up the ground it defeats the purpose.

You can sugar coat it all you like but we're bottom of the ladder (again), destined for the wooden spoon (again) and this year we won't even have the number 1 pick to look forward to. You're kidding yourself if you think we've progressed in the last 3 years. Our skills are absolutely deplorable and turnovers kill us week after week. If you're brutally honest, there's probably 3 blokes on our list at the moment (excluding Docherty who's out again) that would get a game at another club right now....Cripps, Walsh, McKay.

How many times this year has Dow butchered a shot at goal at key moments in games? I'm sick of hearing about "elite runner", "great endurance" and "breakaway speed" when they talk about draftees. If you can't do the most basic thing in the game, kick the footy, then you can have all the running ability in the world and you'll be good at chasing an opponent and not much else. I hope I'm wrong, but we'll look back in 3 or 4 years on the 2017 draft as another one that we slaughtered.

I was taken with Bolton initially and his youthful enthusiasm and honesty but we've stalled, our young players are not coming on (Walsh excluded) and for the life of me I can't work out our game plan. In defence we're like Richmond of about 6 or 7 years ago where opponents just waited for the poor skills and decision making to eventually show through and they'd turn it over trying to kick short, backwards and sideways. If Thomas and Simpson are all we've got to keep a cool head down back then we're in strife. Newman showed some fight yesterday but even he turned it over numerous times.

Agree with EB's earlier comment about Kreuzer. He's been a warrior for us but he looked tired and cumbersome yesterday against a smaller/inexperienced opponent. Like many, for weeks I was calling for Kennedy to be in there to help Cripps but he showed us exactly why he hasn't been in there....slow and ineffective. Take Cripps and Walsh out of that midfield and at the moment we've got nothing. SPS/Fisher/Dow etc just don't do anywhere near enough. Yes they're young, but so is Walsh...so is Cripps.

This mid-season draft is a free hit of sorts but we're gonna blow another chance with Deluca. There's a reason he only played 4 games in 3 years with Fremantle.....slow and not big enough.

I'm not sure how many more weeks Bolton has got left but another bad loss this week and we need to be put out of our misery.

Forget the games this season. 

It was halfway through the third quarter that the penny dropped for me that yesterdays game was going to be a poor outcome win or loss because simply we played terribly and still almost won.

The missed shots by Dow are all part of a learning curve.  Each time he gets that opportunity he gets the chance to learn from it and fix it.  This time he missed and actually was a better player for the rest of that game.

The reason why we keep stumbling is that the kids are learning.  Too much, too quickly.  Stick with them.  This ride is a bumpy one.  It's two years away from bearing fruit, and next year is going to be a lot more fun.

[spf]

Everyone is smart in retrospect. We had eleven players who came out of the past four drafts in the team yesterday. This coming off four drafts where we have turned over a third to a quarter of our list. There is a lack of continuity in the team which has to be expected and is on display most weeks. This is the plan the Club laid out and is sticking to. I think they are twelve months behind where they wanted to be and I think they have the ingredients of a very good team but they need time to become a team. I like BB press conferences, I am not sure what people want him to say.  They have a plan. I dont see or hear what the alternative is.
I think we need some hungry half forwards, Pickett is a big loss, and we need pace out of the backline, which explains Garlett being developed for down back, we also need another young ruckman to develop.
It is a five-year plan and people need to do more than say everything is rubbish,  they need to articulate what they think needs to be done, how it would be implemented and how it is a better process than what is happening now.

Exactly right. Where is their 'plan'?