2018 Rd 9: Post Game Calm: Carlton vs Melbourne

[PaulP]

Ground up rebuild is harder....you need to be rebuilding, reinventing while you are still a good team and have good senior players to look after and help your newbies.

Stkilda did a ground up with Pelchen and its failed.....same problem as us, not enough mid range/ elite depth to support their newbies, they also went a lot of small bodies too and tried
to top up with fringe GWS players ie Bruce, Steele and other fringe types like Roberton, Weller, Savage, Kobie Stevens etc...hasnt worked..

EB, do you think the players or Richardson is the bigger problem ? He doesn't inspire much confidence in me tbh.

[ElwoodBlues1]

Actually Principal LODS, I think it is simply that last week we really didn't have an opponent and this week we did, and when the pressure came we folded badly, very badly. This is a theme with us, when genuine heat comes from an opponent, we fold.

I won a dubious bet with Mrs Baggers... she bet at loss by under 34 pts. I bet a loss by 10+ goals, just knew it in my bones that an in-form side would tear us up. Oh, what was the bet? Let's just say I don't feel as bad now...

I really believe that even with the Curnows we would have still suffered a heavy loss, not 100+ pts, but probably still around 10 gls.

Unfortunately I really don't think we know much about where we really are at present. I said a few weeks back that I suspect after the bye, when we have most players available, we should do better, and win a few games - if not, then I wouldn't want to be BB at year's end.

By the bye, or just after, we should have (by year's end, anyway), Williamson, Pickett, SOS - CUZ, Marchbank and Byrne. And we'll know more about the SOJ experiment as a mid/fwd, whether Weitering has regained consistent touch, Polson as a run-with, whether Cuningham can actually put more than 2 qtrs together, whether Kennedy is injured or another GWS dud.

Bottom line is that we need two gun, mature aged, BIG BODIED midfielders at this year's draft...no more little bodies FFS.  Murphy, ZF and SPS should be outside mids, not inside... just to fkn small.

If not for Cripps, god knows how many huge losses we would have had.

I think we need to buy in two readymade decent  BIG BODIED mids...we need them up and running now...Cripps needs the help now......Dow and OBrien need to be on wings not contesting with Bigger bodies at the coalface....

[shawny]

I’ve been one of the positive glass half full guys. Today however has made me seriously doubt things.

Been said on here a lot but wtf do we continue to top our list up with players of the calibre of O’Shea, mullet and will even add Garlett to this. Then on top of that we continue to back them in and play them week in week out when they are clearly not up to it.

The rebuild is into the 3rd year yet apart of charlie, fisher, and if I’m generous McKay, all the rest we selected are at best ‘jury still out’ prospects.

I know we need to stay the course and I know some of the guys we have got in are still very green but my point in we are 3 trade periods in and I would have liked to have at least 6-7 in the zac fisher level which we simply don’t have.

Far from ideal.

[Thryleon]

Murphy's

Luke Livingston's...

It's a problem we'll hopefully be able to stop after this lot.

I watched Brisbane vs hawthorn and realised something.  Daniel Rich, Mitch Robinson,  Dane zorko,  Dane beams, Alan Christensen,  Lewis Taylor, Luke hodge even Charlie Cameron is 23. 

They are playing kids with much more accomplished senior players who actually bring something to the team besides experience.

This is why we are struggling.  We hope our kids will be better off for it, but but we are running them around with Cameron o Shea,  Sam kerridge,  and whilst we have some handy types they aren't blisteringly fast or skilled enough or strong enough or classy enough to compete and carry the load for kids around them.

[ElwoodBlues1]

EB, do you think the players or Richardson is the bigger problem ? He doesn't inspire much confidence in me tbh.

Richardson is a good assistant.........not inventive or hard enough IMO, see him at Bunnings a lot, bit of a DIYer like me, talks to the punters
and is a nice bloke. Clarkson would probably tell them to feck off and leave him alone.....
Saints need a new recruiter and a new coach...I think Richardson will be fired at seasons end..

Saints lack leadership...Geary and Jack Stevens doesnt cut it...they need a player like Hodge for a couple of season to direct traffic on the field.
If Josh Kennedy from the Swans retired he might be a good get for a year or two and then coach as an assistant......

[ElwoodBlues1]

Luke Livingston's...

It's a problem we'll hopefully be able to stop after this lot.

I watched Brisbane vs hawthorn and realised something.  Daniel Rich, Mitch Robinson,  Dane zorko,  Dane beams, Alan Christensen,  Lewis Taylor, Luke hodge even Charlie Cameron is 23. 

They are playing kids with much more accomplished senior players who actually bring something to the team besides experience.

This is why we are struggling.  We hope our kids will be better off for it, but but we are running them around with Cameron o Shea,  Sam kerridge,  and whilst we have some handy types they aren't blisteringly fast or skilled enough or strong enough or classy enough to compete and carry the load for kids around them.

Correct....what do we do to fix it?

[PaulP]

Richardson is a good assistant.........not inventive or hard enough IMO, see him at Bunnings a lot, bit of a DIYer like me, talks to the punters
and is a nice bloke. Clarkson would probably tell them to feck off and leave him alone.....
Saints need a new recruiter and a new coach...I think Richardson will be fired at seasons end..

Saints lack leadership...Geary and Jack Stevens doesnt cut it...they need a player like Hodge for a couple of season to direct traffic on the field.
If Josh Kennedy from the Swans retired he might be a good get for a year or two and then coach as an assistant......

Thanks Elwood.

[Lods]

Luke Livingston's...

It's a problem we'll hopefully be able to stop after this lot.

I watched Brisbane vs hawthorn and realised something.  Daniel Rich, Mitch Robinson,  Dane zorko,  Dane beams, Alan Christensen,  Lewis Taylor, Luke hodge even Charlie Cameron is 23. 

They are playing kids with much more accomplished senior players who actually bring something to the team besides experience.

This is why we are struggling.  We hope our kids will be better off for it, but but we are running them around with Cameron o Shea,  Sam kerridge,  and whilst we have some handy types they aren't blisteringly fast or skilled enough or strong enough or classy enough to compete and carry the load for kids around them.

Yep... and that's the problem!
We have gone overboard on the rebuild and left ourselves lacking in that mid age range of players.
It's not irretrievable and Liddle actually mentioned it in an interview last week.
We've been to the draft three times
Our emphasis this year will now shift to acquiring  some quality mid-age range players (uncontracted and free agency)

[LP]

They are playing kids with much more accomplished senior players who actually bring something to the team besides experience.

Me and Lods have been banging on about this for ages, we've not enough structure in place for kids to grow on!

We've taken our green shoots and thrown them into a field full of weeds!

Lions have kids surrounded by experience!

Play our kids too long surrounded by bad influences, and they'll develop bad habits that you cannot fix!

Bad habits are so hard to fix, learn something the right way from the start and it becomes a good habit!

[Thryleon]

Correct....what do we do to fix it?

My fear is that we can't fix it with this lot, and we have to play the wait and see game.

We heard a lot about billy hartung and his supposed character issues but have a look at where we are currently struggling (outside run) and explain to me why we didn't look at him...


We need to get a couple of cast off's IMHO.  Blokes who are surplus to requirements but would walk up start in our team.