2018 Rd 7: Pre Game Paranoia: Carlton vs Adelaide

[deags]

I agree. And I would think if Kreuzer had stayed fit, we'd be having a whole different discussion about picking a ruck at number one, and there'd be a whole lot less hype about the overrated bloke from WC.

[LP]

I posted stats, you post gobbledy gook.

You want it to be, but the only non-subjective measure we have is when they played in the same games with or against each other. Everything else you write is opinion!

It's the accepted way to measure sporting talent, the very same way many sports establish the best of the best, by examining their results either side by side or head to head.

If I looked at Jacobs versus all teams, Carlton is middle of the field.

Sam Jacobs Against Opposition Teams

Hardly dominant!

[LP]

I agree. And I would think if Kreuzer had stayed fit, we'd be having a whole different discussion about picking a ruck at number one, and there'd be a whole lot less hype about the overrated bloke from WC.

Kreuzer has only just reached the peak age for a ruckmen, and he was probably looking like one of our better players this season prior to his injury, that even includes Charlie's half game extravagances or Cripps high contested possession games.

As much rhetoric as fans like to post, I suspect the team would kill for a fit and in form Kreuzer out on the park with the rest of them! It clear to see how much weight he carries regarding the teams fortunes.

[deags]

He is like the armoured division that everyone lines up behind.
Him and Cripps on ball if both fit and firing will be devastating.

[LP]

He is like the armoured division that everyone lines up behind.
Him and Cripps on ball if both fit and firing will be devastating.

There is some irony in people labeling his pick a waste, historically in addition to rucking many suggested they wanted Kreuzer to be the winning KPF, the Cripps like midfielder(Even before Cripps joined Carlton it was SpecialK that was proposed as a Judd chop-out type), some have asked for him to play KPD when we were light on for gorilla type defenders, and we've seen him rove inside the F50 like we one day hope/want to see from McKay!

Not too bad for an alleged wasted pick, what more can he do?

Without naming names, I get the feeling that if some of the forum posters were put in charge of a council road crew, the first thing they would do is sack the person digging for failing to do everything! :o

[laj]

Pretty confident.

But for those playing at home....

Sauce vs Kreuzer has occured 4 times previously.

Here is a quick breakdown.

R8, 2012 
Kreuzer (17HOs, 7 poss, 1 goal)
Jacobs (38, 6, 0)
*Hampson (29, 5, 0)

Sauce clearly better in the ruck than Kreuzer, so much so that Hampson was better than Kreuzer as well.

R10, 2015
Kreuzer (11, 11, 2)
Jacobs (39, 18, 1)
*Wood (17, 9, 0)

Sauce better than both Kreuzer and Wood combined. Despite kicking 2 goals to 1, our 2 players efforts were matched by their 1.

R16, 2016
Kreuzer (15,8,0)
Jacobs (36, 13, 3)
*Phillips (19,9, 0)

Sauce not only matched our 2 players efforts, but surpassed them with 3 goals. Jacobs 2 brownlow votes

R15, 2017
Kreuzer (42, 14, 0)
Jacobs (31, 10, 1)
*Casboult (8, 12, 2)
**Jenkins (9, 13, 3)

Even with Kreuzer in career best form, Jacobs was able to hit the scoreboard more, together with the respective backups.

So basically Jacobs has been able to outdo the work of 2 of our ruckmen himself in most instances.

I'll leave the argument to you guys but what I did notice that Kreuzer played his best game of those 4 when he was essentially the lone ruck. Kreuzer has very often been $hithouse when he has to share ruck duties but as lone luck with relief from Casboult he is a far better player. Goes from $hit to star.

That last game must've had a few stoppages, 50 hitouts to 40.

[kruddler]

You want it to be, but the only non-subjective measure we have is when they played in the same games with or against each other. Everything else you write is opinion!

It's the accepted way to measure sporting talent, the very same way many sports establish the best of the best, by examining their results either side by side or head to head.

If I looked at Jacobs versus all teams, Carlton is middle of the field.

Sam Jacobs Against Opposition Teams

Hardly dominant!

You seem to be forgetting the stats i wrote were exactly that!
If you don't trust the stats, see who has more brownlow votes in head to head. Sauce 2-0.

I don't care who is the better ruckman against other teams. Its not about that! Its about head to head and their matchup this week. Nothing else matters. We can have the same discussion every week with Kreuzer vs ***** and it will be different.

You keep trying totwist the argument into something it is not as deflection.

[kruddler]

I'll leave the argument to you guys but what I did notice that Kreuzer played his best game of those 4 when he was essentially the lone ruck. Kreuzer has very often been $hithouse when he has to share ruck duties but as lone luck with relief from Casboult he is a far better player. Goes from $hit to star.

That last game must've had a few stoppages, 50 hitouts to 40.

Lone ruck??
You've been telling everyone for years that casboult is so important to us because he is a 2nd ruckman and cant be judged as just a key forward.  :-[

[LP]

You keep trying to twist the argument into something it is not as deflection.

Nope.

Neither of your arguments stack up, either head to head or side by side Jacobs has not outperformed Kreuzer. And Jacobs has been nothing special on average when he played against us either!

Both have had good games, but hardly anything to claim dominance!

Given how good Jacobs seems to go against some of the other clubs, we can probably undeniably rate our result as a win whether you think Kreuzer was good or bad!

[kruddler]

Nope.

Neither of your arguments stack up, either head to head or side by side Jacobs has not outperformed Kreuzer. And Jacobs has been nothing special on average when he played against us either!

Both have had good games, but hardly anything to claim dominance!

Given how good Jacobs seems to go against some of the other clubs, we can probably undeniably rate our result as a win whether you think Kreuzer was good or bad!

Brownlow votes head to head. Jacobs 2 - Kreuzer 0.