Carlton pasted by Pies (Post Game)

[Lods]

There must be or has been someone or something at the club during the tenure of these guys that has caused them to be like this? It would be highly unlikely for ALL or even many of them to have this trait built in surely? In other words, it's more likely to be something they've learned at the club over years. What could be the common denominators?
Culture (onfield/off field)  inherited by the group from a previous time?
Coaching - been a problem, by degree, under multiple coaches?
Prolonged lack of effective leadership (lack of) - like growing up without a father can be detrimental?
Recruitment selection - bad psych profiling?
All of the above?
I give up, but maybe someone closer to the club could answer?

I don't think the club have the answers.
They haven't fixed it.
I put this up before but removed it because it was bit long winded (and a bit self indulgent ).
I'll stick it up again.
I want to make the point that many of us argued these traits over the last ten years, not just me....
but these are just a selection of my posts.
It doesn't identify a cause but it does show it's not a recent phenomenon and something quite a few of us have been banging on about for over 10 years

8/6/ 2013

We're still a team of individuals.

Some are brilliant individuals.....but there seems to be an unwillingness at times to work 'for' or 'with' others.

We often get the individual super performance, like Waite last night, but when that happens others, for whatever reason, go missing.

Until we get that individualism out of the system and start working as a unit we won't improve.

I'm watching the Swans in action at the moment. They work 'for' and 'with' each other.....there is a brilliant "Team".

3/7/2009

The most important thing we need to do is to move away from the period of the 'individual' that has plagued us for many seasons.
During the dark days.....and it probably began pre Pagan, the Carlton side changed from the consumate 'team' mentality of the 1990's to a team of individuals.
In some cases it was forced by the necessity of survival.
Players played to ensure that their place was secure without too much emphasis on the team side of things.
We retain on our list a number of players who went through the worst of this period and there are arguments that some of that 'selfishness' has been retained in the make-up of some of these players.
The task is to slowly turn this list over so that we have a team of players that are committed and prepared to sacrifice aspects of their game for the greater good of the team.
We do have some examples of these 'selfless' players on our list but unfortunately their ability has not always matched their determination and application.They have however been given a fair bit of game, sometimes much to the 'disappointment' of fans who have been derisive in their comments and continually surprised how such 'duds' could get a game. Their time is probably drawing to a close and they will soon be replaced, hopefully by youngsters with a similar attitude but with greater skills.

30/6/2008

Too often over the last 5-6 years we have had a team of individuals playing for their own futures and afraid to make mistakes.Some of them have looked after themselves at the expense of doing the team thing. I understand that because that was the culture...every man for themselves.
I think it was largely subconscious but......
When you're going that bad as a team it was probably understandable to be subconsciously a bit selfish.
There were, over this period though, a couple of players that bucked that trend and tended to do the team things at the expense of their own game.

29/3/2008

I think the basic problem we face is the same problem we've faced in recent years.........
We look and play like a group of individuals, not as a 'team'. There are some very talented individuals out there, some also play with a bit of passion and display enthusiasm when goals are kicked etc..... but they still play with little system and understanding.

The only solution for that is time..... but in the last five years we've turned over players at such a rate that in respect of 'team' development we're back to scratch. Hopefully players like Judd and Hadley who have been parts of successful teams can short circuit this process.
Here's a problem I always have with the 'list is no good' argument.
(and let's take Denis out of the equation or we all know where this will end up  ..... but draw your own conclusions  )

2/3/2007

Australian Football is not a game of individuals.
It's a team game.
Names on a team sheet can look mighty impressive but it's how they combine and complement one another that is important.

You can have a team of very good players but if their main concern is individual performance and not working hard for one another they will still as a group produce an ordinary performance.

The Carlton teams I remember as successful have always had very good players but it was the understanding and confidence in one another they
possessed that made them special.

I think the thing that has frustrated me most in the last few years has been the inability to perform as a team rather than a lack of individual brilliance.

4/12/2005

The TEAM element is an important aspect.

You can have a list of very talented individuals but unless they combine as a group Premierships are a long way off. That was the main difference between our Wizard Cup performances and a couple of games towards the end of the season and the season as a whole.
On most occasions during the year players seemed to be too concerned about their own individual performances rather than supporting one another and playing a Team game.

Now the combination we're talking about takes a time to develop. A perfect example of a TEAM performance was our 1995 group. They had an understanding, particularly in defence, and a commitment to one another that had developed over many games of playing together.

We've just gone through a radical reconstruction of our playing list that is still continuing. Until this process settles down and we get a stable list of players with a number of years of playing together we are unlikely to have the TEAM understanding required to win Premierships.

Great players don't win Flags, Great teams do. That’s what I'm looking for in terms of development over the next couple of seasons.

25/5/2005

At the moment our side are playing as individuals. It's a common theme in a number of threads as Nicole points out. You can understand 'why'. Because the vast majority are fighting for their footballing survival and the constant changes to personnel mean the side is never allowed to settle.

Let's start tanking games some say. Or as it's more properly put "maximise our draft selections."

But you see, what will happen is that a couple of the most talented youngsters in the land will be brought into a group lacking in confidence, fighting for their own individual places and looking over their shoulders at the 'new' threats to those places....because they don't work as a team here.

Let's have another cleanout at the end of the year some say. Were not going to get much at the trade table for any of them. They're a group of "rejects" (some twice over) from a struggling club. We'll just have to delist them. So if we haven't got anything to trade we're not going to get those low draft picks to supplement the ones we've already "earned." 

But at least we'll have some new blood.

But, But, But.....How long will it take this new blood to settle in?
How long will it take them to bond together?
How long before they undertand the strengths and weaknesses of their team-"mates"
How long before they can support them?
How long before they'll be prepared to take a hit for them.
Before they'll put their body on the line for them.
Before they'll run and jump and bump until their bodies are totally spent because they don't want to let the TEAM down.

...and they're just my posts...the scary thing is you could take any one of them and drop them (names aside) into last week’s post match (this) thread.