CV and mad panic behaviour

[Thryleon]

So really you're asserting you do not think any vaccine is really regardless of available evidence, does that make this debate pointless?

It would be reasonable to declare that position when commenting, it doesn't make you an anti-vaxer but it's not a trivial perspective to start from. What do you want from some 3rd party commenting like myself, are you trying to convert?

No you are asserting that, because it makes that argument easier to attack and much easier to paint me as a Pete Evans type.  To date, I have not refused a vaccine, but this might be my first rodeo.  The anti vax crowd is who this entire argument is aimed at to start with.  I am quite balanced with my views, particularly in respect to COVID.  I have not stated the thing about the epidemiologist for the first time on this forum, and frankly, I did so thinking that I might have to make that argument again pretty quickly because they found a magic covid bullet and lo and behold here we are.

Why dont we simply keep our country COVID free for 2 years, and then get some meaningful data about what a covid vaccine means for the nations that have vaccinated, rather than become a guinea pig like the rest?

Isn't that smarter than making everyone get a vaccine?  Why?  If they give us a vaccine, and then no one gets covid it doesnt vindicate anything if we stay covid safe here.  If they give us a vaccine, and our numbers are similar, we keep wearing masks, the lockdowns continue, then there is minimal value in the vaccine too.  Instead we are jumping on board for a vaccine, that we statistically dont see in our community, and havent really seen in our community.  Will it be bad, will it be good?  Will people get sick, will they die? Can you answer these questions?

Id like to see a lot more data about all of it, but I am not going to get that choice, and you can bet your bottom dollar that my vaccine proposition is much closer to me, than it is to you.  Frankly, I think you are debating this with yourself, and not me. 

Yes, the "life threatening" part is interesting, is that what it takes for an illness to be treated seriously?

No, but the only confirmed cases I know of, are back to work, and generally symptom free aside from compromised senses of smell.

Now that in itself is bad enough, but lets place that to the side for a moment.  Lets inject people with a vaccine that we are not even confident works, because the rest of the world says so?  What about our Nurse in portugal who got the jab in her early 40's and passed away within 48 hours?

https://www.theportugalnews.com/news/202...cine/57533

its ok, she didnt suffer any adverse reactions, and had no underlying health concerns.  Must have died of natural causes.

A lot of people talk about the fiscal and mental health effects of dealing with COVID lockdowns, what mental health or fiscal effects of illness induced sterility, partial paralysis or paraplegia, anosmia, myopia and the growing list of neurological disorders?

In the UK after millions and millions of cases, the statistical numbers relating to the widespread long term effects are concerning enough for me to say vaccines are worth it.

  Thats a different debate.  I am not saying vaccines are not worth it.  I dont want the COVID vaccine, and Id rather we took a different approach, rather than jumping on the Vaccine bandwagon.  We have happily kept our country rather COVID free, and I am an advocate of that approach not a vaccination.

The report about 10% of cases suffer significant long term issues like those listed above, add to that we now have burgeoning reports of late fatalities from secondary admissions to hospital months and months after the initial hospitalisation. Doesn't that count for anything?

  That counts for something with respect to what the virus is capable of doing, but if faced with a covid positive outcome, or a vaccine outcome, i choose the former not the latter in respect to where we live and our case numbers.  I am not certain to get Covid, but if i get a vaccine I am certainly worried that it will cause more harm to me than the virus will, because probability states that whilst we are covid free I am unlikely to contract it, and even if I did, probability also states that I have a high chance of having minimal issues (asymptomatic cases are far more common than symptomatic according to the case numbers and not all positive cases lead to medical treatment is another factor the data).  So far, 100% of vaccinations received a vaccine.  Sure, not all of them had adverse effects, but some do and some have, and referring back to my epidemiologist whom I quoted earlier, he asserted that they are unlikely to produce one so quickly.  Ergo, what are we ACTUALLY getting?

I wonder if the COVID deniers would have been so quick to release their kids to a mild infection, if they knew there was a risk of little Jimmy or Jill becoming sterile. Of course we do not know the long term outcome, but is it worth the risk?

If Trump hadn't been in power and politically smashing the CDC or NIH, we'd have reliable numbers from the US as well by now, the debate would be dead and buried(bad choice of words).

Not relevant, but nice try.