2017 Rd 2 Pre Game Panic Carlton vs Melbourne

[LP]

The main issue for folks, from what I can see, is the question of his value which is obviously related to the size of his paycheck.

If, for the sake of argument, he was being paid half of what he was contracted at, would the same criticisms be advanced? Don't know, but I would suspect they would be at a much lower level.

Without criticising Daisy, but much much more was expected by many from him, primarily in terms of on field performance,  for what he is/was being paid. He acknowledged that himself. I think what we are really mainly seeing is a lot of frustration being vented rather than actual blaming or hatred of him personally tbh.

He's clearly in our best 22, what he gets paid is irrelevant, and we cannot keep butchering our youth under the guise of accelerated development. If the likes of Daisy were not out there Thursday night we'd have lost by far more probably because we would have been even more disorganised.

Continual depressing losses are like Chinese water torture, the kids won't recover from them, the pressure will build and their only way forward will be to find greener pastures.

We need the likes of White, Thomas, Wright, Casboult, Kreuzer, Armfield, Murphy, Gibbs, E.Curnow, Rowe, etc., etc., to stand up and look after the kids. Lead them for feck sake! Not just use them as some sort of sacrificial chop-out  shield of self-preservation to extend their own careers. Last Thursday only Murphy, Kreuzer, Wright and Thomas get a pass mark in this regard.

[cookie2]

He's clearly in our best 22, what he gets paid is irrelevant, and we cannot keep butchering our youth under the guise of accelerated development. If the likes of Daisy were not out there Thursday night we'd have lost by far more probably because we would have been even more disorganised.

Continual depressing losses are like Chinese water torture, the kids won't recover from them, the pressure will build and their only way forward will be to find greener pastures.

We need the likes of White, Thomas, Wright, Casboult, Kreuzer, Armfield, Murphy, Gibbs, E.Curnow, Rowe, etc., etc., to stand up and look after the kids. Lead them for feck sake! Not just use them as some sort of sacrificial chop-out  shield of self-preservation to extend their own careers. Last Thursday only Murphy, Kreuzer, Wright and Thomas get a pass mark in this regard.

He may very well be in our best 22 - not arguing about that - I'm saying that whatever he is providing, and that may be his absolute 100% best,  is seen by many as costing over the odds. However, if you think that what players are paid is irrelevant then I rest my case - I won't pursue the debate any further.

[PaulP]

We have too many try hard plonkers on our list. Some of them (Thomas) are plonkers because they have talent, but have been crippled by injury, and others (Curnow) are plonkers because despite great endurance, they have a poor skill set.

Too many players who have limitations for their own different reasons is a big part of the problem.

[LP]

He may very well be in our best 22 - not arguing about that - I'm saying that whatever he is providing, and that may be his absolute 100% best,  is seen by many as costing over the odds. However, if you think that what players are paid is irrelevant then I rest my case - I won't pursue the debate any further.

What a club offers them is very relevant, once they are on the books it no longer an issue.

All the players are even-steven with each new training session, it cannot be any other way without destroying the club culture and team moral.

One of the reasons a lot of us hate MM was because of the perceived bias against certain players, mostly derived from some on-field mistake and extended into the off-field and the media by the coach who in his own words "defends his players". He wanted a band of loyal followers, a completely anarchistic and obsolete way of managing a team, and failed in his attempt by falling at the very first hurdle, trust.

But it's not just MM that has questions to answer in this regard, the attitude from the likes of Henderson, Lucas, Yarran and Everitt also needs significant scrutiny. Their "marking time" attitude can be a cancer that is almost impossible to remove. At the moment I fear we have quite a few of that type left on our list, on the surface of it Boekhorst appears to be one, I'm not sure about Jaksch, Jones, Casboult, Gorringe, Lamb or Buckley in this regard either. The biggest public indicator of this "failing trait" is a players unwillingness to sacrifice themselves for team-mates on field.

When a team-mate has the opportunity to make a block, create space, a diversion or interference it should be automatic. Those are the valuable 1%ers. Too many of our blokes either don't do it or see it as optional.

[Gointocarlton]

Yet everyone is calling for his head for this game.....almost exclusively.

Peoples bias are clouding their judgements in regards to daisy.

Their bias comes from many areas.
1. His paycheque
2. His former club
3. His recruitment coinciding with the exit of a much loved small forward
4. His friendship with a not-so-loved former coach
5. His bad luck with injuries

NONE of that is his fault.

I have always supported Daisy's recruitment but I think injuries have crueled his career and his time may be up. Dont care how much he gets paid, don't care where he came from, don't care who he is mates with. Can he do his role and contribute? Only the coaches know that. From an outside looking in, he doesnt look like he has much left in the tank. Time will tell.

[LoveNavy]

Yet everyone is calling for his head for this game.....almost exclusively.

I'd be in the "almost" group then. Not sure how exclusive it is though
I've been frustrated by what I see (which is far from what's on show of course) from Daisy on game day, and further by his unfortunate injuries. This is primarily due to having expectations of him really adding to on field success. It hasn't eventuated quite like that, at least not consistently.

When you accept the strengths and limitations of the individual and the team, it's easier to comprehend. It's easier to see where the coaching staff may be coming from. Two questions remain for mine:
Will CFC get value for doing the trade compared to other options available at the time?
Can our current crop gain significantly from his contributions?
IMO its a no and yes, respectively.
As we don't have time travel available, we can't change 1.
As he will be one of us this year, I'm hopeful those in the know will facilitate him giving the best he has to give. For those reasons, I'll treat him the respect our players deserve. And no doubt feel the pangs of frustration from time to time.

[PaulP]

I have always supported Daisy's recruitment but I think injuries have crueled his career and his time may be up. Dont care how much he gets paid, don't care where he came from, don't care who he is mates with. Can he do his role and contribute? Only the coaches know that. From an outside looking in, he doesnt look like he has much left in the tank. Time will tell.

Yes, it's stating the obvious, but come season's end, we'll know how much the club rates him.

[kruddler]

I have always supported Daisy's recruitment but I think injuries have crueled his career and his time may be up. Dont care how much he gets paid, don't care where he came from, don't care who he is mates with. Can he do his role and contribute? Only the coaches know that. From an outside looking in, he doesnt look like he has much left in the tank. Time will tell.

The bold part is the key.

That is what gets him picked in the side and others not.

I agree he doesn't look like he has much left. He knows that himself. Doesn't stop him busting his behind each and every time he crosses the line. Something i only wish the rest of our blokes could do.

[Gointocarlton]

The bold part is the key.

That is what gets him picked in the side and others not.

I agree he doesn't look like he has much left. He knows that himself. Doesn't stop him busting his behind each and every time he crosses the line. Something i only wish the rest of our blokes could do.

Agreed

[blue4life]

Daisy is the least of our worries.
As for the trade being poor value at least he's playing senior footy, unlike Jaksch who we traded pick seven for.
Now that trade really sucks.