AFL Rd 17 2024 Post Game Prognostications Carlton vs GWS

[kruddler]

So ignoring all your usual slights, you're going to assert sending TDK back out there on a jabbed up ankle he can barely stand on, barely mobile and unable to jump, is a valid test of his KPD capability.

That's as bad if not worse than claiming TDK against a "no ruck Handbagger squad" is proof solo rucks work, not that anybody would be brazen enough to make that claim!

Even with [member=105]Thryleon[/member] and myself posting the same basic response, the obvious response, you failed to answer either with anything more than smoke and mirrors, as usual!

So TDK couldn't play back because he was sore.
So you are holding out hope for Pittonet to stop Hogan?
TDK isn't a defender.
Pittonet isn't a defender.
No amount of planning could have stopped the onslaught that occured when we lost Weitering.

.....except if we had maybe chosen some more KPD's at the draft table over the past i dunno, 7 years! Who thought of that??

Oh 1 ruck vs cats is not valid because cats were crap. (Keep in mind my comments are for our team, not anybody elses)
0 rucks vs freo last year is also not valid because.....it hurts people arguments too much?

BTW, how many key defenders do we have in the side? Some people say 3. You say you need more.

Funny, i don't recall all of these 'obvious' calls coming in the lead up to the match. Only during.

Maybe offer some pearls of wisdom before this happens rather than halfway through the game if they are so obvious in the future.
Weren't very obvious is the first quarter were they.

[LP]

Doesn't matter what 'what if' game you wanna play, There is no perfect answer.

It wasn't a what if, it actually happened.

You own posts expose the hypocrisy of your position, we all know our depth is weakest in KPP options. Like when just yesterday you question why we didn't go for Ben McKay, not that he'd be much use if he wasn't in the 22 on the day.
[img width=550]https://www.carltonsc.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=6910.0;attach=1499[/img]

Yep their gut running to be at both ends of the ground all the time.defies logic.

....but people want pittonet to replace Ollie ?

You're crying wolf like the boy with his finger in the dyke!

[LP]

On the KPP issue, we need a capable spare on the bench, or at least an option that allows us to re-organise the talls structure should a key KPP go down.

Swapping of a like for like in or out of the 22 is not a useful option, it gives us no security if we still have no spare.

We have all the run we need, yesterday's game proved that, it was the 2nd and 3rd quarter when we we dominated due to the failing health of our KPPs that cost us that game.

When we take BigH out of F50 to ruck, it robs Charlie of opportunity because he gets double teamed. It wasn't until the last Qtr when just before we got on a roll GWS took Aleer off the ground, that Charlie was able to become more of an influence.

[kruddler]

It wasn't a what if, it actually happened.

You own posts expose the hypocrisy of your position, we all know our depth is weakest in KPP options. Like when just yesterday you question why we didn't go for Ben McKay, not that he'd be much use if he wasn't in the 22 on the day.
[img width=550]https://www.carltonsc.com/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=6910.0;attach=1499[/img]You're crying wolf like the boy with his finger in the dyke!

OK, lets explain 7 years of comments and 1 post for all the slow kids out there. (Psst.....thats you )

We do NOT have a capable KPD behind Weitering. This has been an ongoing discussion for years.
We have shoehorned players into that position with Kemp, McGovern and Marchbank. Young is KPD size, but is devoid of all confidence.

So since we continue to ignore this via trade and via draft because "Their simply isn't any KP talent available" and someone like Ben McKay pops up and we do absolutely nothing about it, then that is mismanagement. I called people out on it, as did others.

So if and when your #1 guy goes down in a match, you don't need to shoehorn a 2nd ruck to cover him, you have a capable #2 to step up into that role and not ask too much from a 'KPD' who many think should be a winger or midfielder.
"Who says that?"

You do...

Must admit haven't seen him play this season, the HBF game I refer to might have been 2019 or 2020.

Wing makes sense because I recall him having good run, but turned like the Titanic, suited to positions that he can keep the ball in front of him.

Would he play HBF/Wing for us and release Kemp into the midfield rotations?

...and that took all of 30 seconds to find. I'm sure there is plenty more i can find as well.
Thank you for proving my point for me. We don't have a genuine 2nd KPD, we have shoehorned players into that role.

What is it that you were saying about a single point of failure?? Weitering has been and always will be that single point until we can find someone who can genuinly perform on the gun players.


So how about we deal with reality and stop trying to play the 'what if' game AFTER the fact.

[pertz]

This is about the 4th time you've posted this BS.

Tell me how having Pittonet solved our key defender issues?

You can't.

Let it go.

Again,  can we get a separate topic thread for the ruck debate - getting really tiresome.

[PaulP]

Again,  can we get a separate topic thread for the ruck debate - getting really tiresome.

https://www.carltonsc.com/index.php?topic=6889.0

[LP]

Again,  can we get a separate topic thread for the ruck debate - getting really tiresome.

This is not about ruck [member=673]pertz[/member], it's about the structure of our bench and how we can provide backup for KPPs including rucks and our thin KPD stocks. Most of us, actually nearly all of us, have already posted that we accept one or two rucks as per the MC strategy.

@Kruddler wants to make is specifically about Pitto because he can't let go of his earlier claims, and he largely ignores response like mine own or [member=105]Thryleon[/member] and then re-introduces Pitto. Even making absurd connections between selection and blokes like Ollie Hollands,  Fogarty or Owies, like if Pitto comes in we lose them all instantly into the universal void!

Kruddler will never stop, he's so conflicted he can't let it go, even when posting his own contradictions.

But that doesn't mean we can afford to leave the KPP issue, as it stands it's our greatest weakness.

[LP]

So how about we deal with reality and stop trying to play the 'what if' game AFTER the fact.

You'll post any sort of deflecting rubbish rather than answer the basic question;

What do we do if this again happens to one of our solo KPPs on GF day, the single point failure we deliberately take into games actually happens, just surrender?

[kruddler]

This is not about ruck [member=673]pertz[/member], it's about the structure of our bench and how we can provide backup for KPPs including rucks and our thin KPD stocks.

@Kruddler wants to make is specifically about Pitto because he can't let go of his earlier claims, and he largely ignores response like mine own or [member=105]Thryleon[/member] and then re-introduces Pitto. Even making absurd connections between selection and blokes like Ollie Hollands,  Fogarty or Owies, like if Pitto comes in we lose them all instantly into the universal void!

Kruddler will never stop, he's so conflicted he can't let it go, even when posting his own contradictions.

But that doesn't mean we can afford to leave the KPP issue, as it stands it's our greatest weakness.

[member=673]pertz[/member]
Apologies, but this needs to be sorted out.

LP posts that he doesn't want to use the likes of Harry (or Charlie) or Cripps or Kennedy or risk any KPPs in the ruck because they are more likely to get injured.
LP posts that we need to have another KPP on the bench in case we do get an injury to one.
LP says he is NOT specifically talking about a ruck as KP cover, but he does state that he doesn't want KPPs to be in the ruck. If you don't have KPPs in the ruck then all that is left is other rucks.
LP insists that he is NOT talking about Pittonet though.
LP instead wants some kind of mystery player we don't have on our list to do that role.

LP doesn't post anything about this in the pre-game, or in the in-game thread when we are dominating.
Instead he makes himself out to be some oracle when we get injuries in the game.

I agree, its all about team balance.
My barrow that i've been pushing is that we do not need a 2nd ruck (for team balance).
However, we do need a #2 KPD.
That would allow Kemp and McGovern to play 'smaller' and IF an injury to a KPP crops up in the game, they are there to 'step up' and temporarily fill that role.

Anyone can fill in for a ruck on any given day should you get an injury. We've proven it can work when we've played zero rucks twice and won both. Obviously there have been games where our ruck has played part of a game before being injured too. You do not need a ruck as cover for a ruck.


So.....LP.....who (with the OBVIOUS BENEFIT OF HINDSIGHT) should we have played this game?

[LP]

So.....LP.....who (with the OBVIOUS BENEFIT OF HINDSIGHT) should we have played this game?

If we didn't play Pitto to allow a reshuffle, we could have played Young.

Because LP would rather see a viable KPP backup on the bench, who might get smashed in the 2nd ruck role, rather than risking our Coleman or Brownlow medallists for 3-1/2 qtrs of blunt grunt work. At least Young if not in the ruck allows a reshuffle when Weiters got injured.

Even as poor as Young can be, if he was the one chosen he'd still be useful in the ruck or KPD roles, and have more influence and impact than Fantasia at pretty much any location on the field.

Of course if you want to leverage AFL capable strengths, you can go with Pitto and restructure the rest, and Pitto for Fantasia wouldn't be a loss based on yesterday.

But yesterday, no options, we had no choice but to send our 1st choice ruck and only KPD back onto the field for 3 qtrs of ineffective injury carrying pain and suffering simply because of an MC decision. That won't work in a GF.

Making futuristic statements like, we need to draft one later this year, doesn't solve our KPP issue this season.