AFL Rd 6 2023 Pre Game Prognostications Carlton vs St. Kilda

[spf]

I wonder if Plowman inspires fear amongst opposing players?

He inspires fear in me whenever I see him kick the ball....or try to.

[Gointocarlton]

I would like to see:
Out Plowman Honey Fisher
In Cincotta, Gov and one of Dow/Fog as the 23rd man.
If Gov doesn't get up, Kemp comes in
If Pitto doesn't get up, Mirkov comes in (The TDK/SOS experiment is over for mine)

For those criticising Dow's efforts in the 2's, I want to see if Fisher goes back there and tears it up like Dow has.

[tonyo]

I can just imagine the gnashing of teeth about Will Setterfield going to Essendon. He’s tagging Clayton Oliver out of the game right now. I’m sure all of Setterfield’s Carlton fans can’t understand how we let a 24 year old former pick 5 or 6 get away.

Ironically, Setterfield shut down Oliver in the second last game of last year (the one we should have won).  Problem is, we have several Setterfield types in the current midfield group, which is why we get chopped up in fast games, because basically we are as slow as treacle.  We should be fast-tracking any young ones we have that have even an ounce of pace.

[WASurfer]

Honey hadn't done much in the VFL and then played the last 2 games despite not doing much....weird selection IMO.

Cowan has been solid but might benefit from a week off and give Cincotta a crack. Him and Gov in (assuming he's fit) for Plowman and Cowan.

Hewett isn't playing like he did early last year and might be one to go out and bring Dow in.

Fingers crossed on Pittonet...De Koning was ordinary the other night and continually getting pushed out of the way.

Kemp is a good sub option but probably done enough to come into the 22.

[LP]

Ironically, Setterfield shut down Oliver in the second last game of last year (the one we should have won).  Problem is, we have several Setterfield types in the current midfield group, which is why we get chopped up in fast games, because basically we are as slow as treacle.  We should be fast-tracking any young ones we have that have even an ounce of pace.

Agreed, we are even slower when Setters was in the 22, and no matter what disgruntled fans or trolls say he's not ahead of anyone who remains.

The irony of the fan cries following Setterfield's departure is not lost on me, when he was at Carlton he wore as much whipping boy heat as Plowman, now Setterfield is gone he's the saviour we let slip through! :o

[Mav]

Yep, list management isn’t just stockpiling similar players just in case you need them on a rainy day. And players aren’t just slaves who have no ability to object if they’re being stockpiled.

Imagine if Plowman ends up moving to another club and doing well. He’d then receive the Casboult treatment, with even his detractors bemoaning our failure to keep him just in case we end up with injuries.

[LP]

Imagine if Plowman ends up moving to another club and doing well. He’d then receive the Casboult treatment, with even his detractors bemoaning our failure to keep him just in case we end up with injuries.

Then there is McGovern, Martin and Williams, etc., etc..

We've got so many, you just know we are going to get bitten somewhere eventually.

All these players were better or would be better at other clubs, maybe our problem is too many Chiefs and feck all Indians, which I believe to be the key to list management. I don't want a team full of Mitch Robinsons, but finding and keeping one good example of each type might be nice! A bit of angry, a bit of pace, a bit of attitude!

[Baggers]

Rather than contemplate being bitten by the potential losses of Plowman, Marchbank, Williams, Martin, TDK etc., I'd rather contemplate the opportunities presented re vacant list places and who can fill them.

[madbluboy]

Maybe you weren’t selling him as a hard nut but others were.

This was his draft profile
Having finished his schooling in 2017, Liam Stocker has had the benefit of absolute TAC Cup commitment this season and has flourished. The Haileybury product, who could follow in the footsteps of fellow 2017 alumni Andrew Brayshaw, Luke Davies-Uniacke and Aidan Bonar to be drafted in the first-round, has the rare ability to break games open. The 183cm midfielder initially caught the eye in round three of the TAC Cup season, with a damaging 21-disposal, two-goal display against the Calder Cannons at home. Stocker’s ability to rest deep in the forward-line and hit the scoreboard was also particularly notable in Round 3 of the TAC Cup, drawing comparisons to Richmond champion Dustin Martin as a result.

Missing Vic Metro’s crusade in the National Under 18 Championships with a broken jaw, Stocker’s name did not seem to feature in the conversation of 2018’s top prospects mid-year, but a dominant back-end of the TAC Cup season saw that change. The inside midfielder plays with aggression and tenacity and contributes in all facets of the game, having averaged 23 possessions (12 contested), six clearances, five inside 50s and five tackles from 12 games this season. His status as an elite midfielder became apparent when the Dragons hosted the Pioneers, gathering 35 disposals together with four marks, five tackles and a goal. The St Kilda supporter capped off a memorable season with the coveted Morrish Medal, recognised as the TAC Cup’s best-and-fairest, three votes clear atop the leader-board. It puts the talented junior cricketer in favourable company, with Richmond cult-hero Jack Higgins, Demons ball-magnet Clayton Oliver and Brisbane Lions Rolls-Royce Hugh McCluggage the past three recipients of the award.

STRENGTHS

Aggression
Explosiveness
Leadership
Vertical jump
Size
Stocker’s aggression, explosiveness and tenacity combine to make the oft-used term ‘midfield bull’ quite the fitting description, while he leads through his commanding voice and — more importantly — his actions. Indeed, while Stocker can often be heard ordering direction, his unrelenting attack on the ball is likely to inspire teammates wherever he plies his trade in future. In addition, the midfielder’s versatility, on show when resting at full-forward, is another feature likely to catch the attention of multiple clubs ahead of the 2018 draft. The type of player that makes opposition defences nervous, he presented a constant threat when deployed out of the goal-square. At 83 kilograms, Stocker’s size caused headaches for opposition midfields throughout the season, making him an AFL-ready prospect for 2019.

Stocker showed through the finals series he can play through adversity, which he did while having a clear shoulder injury. He has shot up the draft boards from last season to this year after a huge pre-season and his consistency since coming back from his broken jaw has been noticeable. It is how he earned the Morrish Medal with many best on grounds through Sandringham's season which was mixed, often playing in a team missing its top players through school football, but his game never wavered. Even upon their return, Stocker's consistency remained. He also achieved a massive 85cm running vertical jump at pre-season testing, which is why he can play effectively up forward.

IMPROVEMENTS

Endurance
Durability
Stocker’s game does not present any obvious flaws, but by his own admittance, his endurance could improve, stating “I’m not really fit enough to be an outside mid, so I base myself on the inside and try to get as many clearances as I can”, after being presented the Morrish Medal. While seen as an inside midfielder — focusing on winning contested ball ahead of running all day — his endurance may yet need to improve for AFL level next season. Another potential question mark could arise over Stocker’s durability, who apart from a broken jaw, sustained multiple niggles throughout the season, playing just 12 of a possible 20 TAC Cup games.

DRAFT PROJECTION: 10-25

SUMMARY

Liam Stocker is simply one of the best midfielders in this year’s draft crop. He appears ready to play against men and would be a strong chance to do so at AFL level in 2019 if he can get his body right early on with a full pre-season behind him. Stocker is an elite inside midfielder who bursts out of stoppages, is dangerous when drifting forward, tackles hard and takes marks around the ground. His ability to have an influence throughout four quarters is very good and expect him to be high on a lot of club's draft boards.

[madbluboy]

Rather than contemplate being bitten by the potential losses of Plowman, Marchbank, Williams, Martin, TDK etc., I'd rather contemplate the opportunities presented re vacant list places and who can fill them.

I'm far from Plowman's biggest fan and he did have a shocker on Thursday but he is a handy back up if he gets an easy match up. You would retain him ahead of Marchbank or Cunningham for obvious reasons.
We lost on Thursday because our best players in the midfield were well beaten. Cripps was down, Hewett hasn't looked right since he has come back. Pittonet subbed off forced SOS in the ruck which doesn't work and takes him out of the forward line.