RIP Queen Elizabeth II

[DJC]

You say “they” defended the indigenous Australians, implying they were white guys. But you’re right! Indigenous Australians were excluded from service. A few were allowed in as long as they were “substantially of European origin”. I guess you could say the ANZACs defended the indigenous Australians in the same way they defended kangaroos and koalas. Should we focus on the protection provided as an unintentional consequence of protecting White Australia or should we focus on the discrimination that excluded indigenous Australians from the armed forces?

That's not quite correct Mav.  It is estimated that 15 Indigenous Australians served in the Anglo-Boer War, 1,200 in World War 1 and 6,000 in World War 2.  While the “substantially of European origin” rule was applied, Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Australians  were generally accepted for enlistment if they had not "lived in a tribal environment". 

Discrimination really only kicked in when Indigenous veterans were excluded from the war service benefits granted to all other veterans. Ironically, the Lake Condah Aboriginal Mission in southwestern Victoria was broken up to provide soldier-settlement farms but Aboriginal veterans from the Mission weren't eligible.  Uncle Reg Saunders was from the Mission.  He served in World War 2 and again in Korea and attained the rank of Captain.  He got nothing but his war medals for his exemplary service ... and people wonder why Indigenous Australians don't just accept what they've got.

As an ex-serviceman, nothing annoys me more than "they fought for the Queen".  QE2's reign started in 1952 and those who served in Korea, Vietnam, Malaya, Iraq, and Afghanistan weren't there for the Queen.  They were there because politicians decided that sending our young folk off to fight in other countries was the right thing to do.  I didn't serve the Queen, I served because a bloke whose brother captained Essendon pulled a marble out of a bag and it had my birthday on it.

Paying respect to a dead foreign monarch at the same time as paying respect to Indigenous Australians doesn't work, particularly when that monarch's predecessors oversaw and profited from colonisation. 

[Gointocarlton]

And I find it so ironic that a womans comp refuses to celebrate (for one fucken minute) of one of the most famous women in history.

[Gointocarlton]

Paying respect to a dead foreign monarch at the same time as paying respect to Indigenous Australians doesn't work, particularly when that monarch's predecessors oversaw and profited from colonisation. 

I could not disagree more.

You, me, Mav, everyone on this site are all byproducts of colonisation. As I asked earlier, do we all pack up our shit and fuck off? When does this end. We are now expected, and quite rightly, to use and live by words like reconciliation, inclusion, equality, except no one told me they are conditional.

[Mav]

Quite the contrary, GIC. I think his opinion should be proof that 100% of indigenous Australians feel the same way and the AFLW jumped at shadows. To do otherwise would suggest that a Murdoch newspaper had little respect for journalistic ethics.

[Macca37]

As an ex-serviceman, nothing annoys me more than "they fought for the Queen".  QE2's reign started in 1952 and those who served in Korea, Vietnam, Malaya, Iraq, and Afghanistan weren't there for the Queen.  They were there because politicians decided that sending our young folk off to fight in other countries was the right thing to do.  I didn't serve the Queen, I served because a bloke whose brother captained Essendon pulled a marble out of a bag and it had my birthday on it.

Paying respect to a dead foreign monarch at the same time as paying respect to Indigenous Australians doesn't work, particularly when that monarch's predecessors oversaw and profited from colonisation. 

Completely agree.

[PaulP]

Completely agree.

X2

[ElwoodBlues1]

South Africa seem happy to pay respect to the Queen even with their horrendous past

That's not quite correct Mav.  It is estimated that 15 Indigenous Australians served in the Anglo-Boer War, 1,200 in World War 1 and 6,000 in World War 2.  While the “substantially of European origin” rule was applied, Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander Australians  were generally accepted for enlistment if they had not "lived in a tribal environment". 

Discrimination really only kicked in when Indigenous veterans were excluded from the war service benefits granted to all other veterans. Ironically, the Lake Condah Aboriginal Mission in southwestern Victoria was broken up to provide soldier-settlement farms but Aboriginal veterans from the Mission weren't eligible.  Uncle Reg Saunders was from the Mission.  He served in World War 2 and again in Korea and attained the rank of Captain.  He got nothing but his war medals for his exemplary service ... and people wonder why Indigenous Australians don't just accept what they've got.

As an ex-serviceman, nothing annoys me more than "they fought for the Queen".  QE2's reign started in 1952 and those who served in Korea, Vietnam, Malaya, Iraq, and Afghanistan weren't there for the Queen.  They were there because politicians decided that sending our young folk off to fight in other countries was the right thing to do.  I didn't serve the Queen, I served because a bloke whose brother captained Essendon pulled a marble out of a bag and it had my birthday on it.

Paying respect to a dead foreign monarch at the same time as paying respect to Indigenous Australians doesn't work, particularly when that monarch's predecessors oversaw and profited from colonisation. 

My father and Grandfather were volunteers  who fought in the great wars for the Country and for the safety of the Commonwealth, my grandfather was a prisoner of war and tortured by the Germans, he was proud to have served for the Country and the Royals.
I'm a non Royalist and consider the concept of Royal Blood and superior bloodlines deserving higher reward and status ridiculous but Lizzie did a difficult job well and I'm happy to give a minute of my time to respect her and my relatives belief in the Commonwealth system and contribution to the evolution of Australia whether there be both good and bad involved.
As GTC says where does the hate end, people have to move on one day...the Nelson Mandela Foundation wrote a great tribute to the Queen and there is a man who knew a bit more about racism and forgiveness than all of us...

[LP]

You say “they” defended the indigenous Australians, implying they were white guys. But you’re right! Indigenous Australians were excluded from service. A few were allowed in as long as they were “substantially of European origin”. I guess you could say the ANZACs defended the indigenous Australians in the same way they defended kangaroos and koalas. Should we focus on the protection provided as an unintentional consequence of protecting White Australia or should we focus on the discrimination that excluded indigenous Australians from the armed forces?

Ahh, the mischievous "they"!

We've been down this path before, and when you deliberately misdirect the use of such terms it really says something, but whatever your focus on "they" states, it states it about yourself Mav, not anybody else, not the Brits, not the Americans, not the Europeans, not even our 1st Nations or other Indigenous people, just you Mav and you alone!

[Thryleon]

Hypothetical.

Had the British not claimed terra australis in the name of the king, what does Australia and the pacific isles look like today?

Are we south American colonised?

Are we an offshoot of China?

There are a multitude of things than can be said about the British but I wonder if the indigenous Australians would have had as much recognition today had they been taken over by another thallasocracy.

[Mav]

Western Bulldogs director Belinda Duarte, herself a Wotjobaluk and Dja Dja Wurrung woman, said the concept of commemorating the Queen's life during Indigenous Round had 'unearthed deep wounds'.

“While for many Australians it’s seen as appropriate to recognise the significance of the Queen’s passing, we must understand what this brings up for First Peoples, the impact of colonisation and what the monarchy represents to us and our families,” Duarte said.

https://au.yahoo.com/sports/nrlw-player-...20430.html

Good move by the AFLW. All the conservative whingers can moan about is a lack of a minute’s silence. But shoehorning that minute’s silence into Indigenous Round may well have sparked the sort of outburst that the above article reported. A female Indigenous NRLW player posted:

Todays a good fkn day, uncle Luke announces his tour, and this dumb dog dies Happpy fkn Friday

By acting promptly, the AFLW secured much more silence from its Indigenous players than 1 minute per game.