General Discussions

[PaulP]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre...keep-dying

[kruddler]

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfre...keep-dying

Can i offer a suggestion.

If you are going to post a link, perhaps include a paragraph explaining what the hell it is about....or why you think its worth posting and being brought up for discussion.

[Thryleon]

Both good reads.

Libs up to no good, and how Uber has ruined employee rights.

[PaulP]

https://theconversation.com/oregon-just-...orm-150806

[Baggers]

https://theconversation.com/oregon-just-...orm-150806

Thank you, Pauly. Good read. We're finally growing up... well, in some areas!

[Gointocarlton]

https://theconversation.com/oregon-just-...orm-150806

Call me old fashioned, naive, uneducated, whatever, I wouldn't support that no matter what arguments are put up.

[Thryleon]

Call me old fashioned, naive, uneducated, whatever, I wouldn't support that no matter what arguments are put up.

Nothing wrong with your position.

Portugal did this to great success and now they sort out people with drug addiction in mental health spaces.

Perhaps they are more successful at rehabilitation by removing the seedy stigma and possibly make it safer to actually do drugs.

I think we who oppose these laws get swept up in this becoming socially acceptable which is potentially a different case. 


I stated this and read the article second.  Note the language.  Rates of overdose.  They mention use of cocaine but I think data can be cherry picked to suit an agenda here.

[PaulP]

Call me old fashioned, naive, uneducated, whatever, I wouldn't support that no matter what arguments are put up.

People can turn just about anything into a substance of abuse, if they are so predisposed : prescription drugs, illicit drugs, grog, tobacco, petrol, glue, you name it. Whilst I am fully supportive of this move, little will change until we address the core issues of why people abuse things in the first place. This, in my view, taps into several aspects of life and society in general : income, education, support etc. I'm not a fan of laying all the blame on the individual, which seems an extremely easy and lazy position to take when such issues are discussed. These are massive problems, and will never be solved unless we all participate in solving them, rather than isolating and finger pointing.

I'm not suggesting you're doing these things, just to be clear.

[capcom]

Call me old fashioned, naive, uneducated, whatever, I wouldn't support that no matter what arguments are put up.

Call me in total agreement

[Baggers]

People can turn just about anything into a substance of abuse, if they are so predisposed : prescription drugs, illicit drugs, grog, tobacco, petrol, glue, you name it. Whilst I am fully supportive of this move, little will change until we address the core issues of why people abuse things in the first place. This, in my view, taps into several aspects of life and society in general : income, education, support etc. I'm not a fan of laying all the blame on the individual, which seems an extremely easy and lazy position to take when such issues are discussed. These are massive problems, and will never be solved unless we all participate in solving them, rather than isolating and finger pointing.

I'm not suggesting you're doing these things, just to be clear.

That perspective is spot on Pauly but is a long way off in terms of social acceptance. So much easier to demonize/scapegoat one person than think about what made them that way and addressing that.

To give some perspective, briefly. I've worked with addicts, including incarcerated criminals - never did I encounter one of them, male or female, who hadn't experienced physical, psychological or sexual abuse as a child... not one.

Absolutely correct to focus attention on the 'why' of what drives folks to addictions/psychological escape whether they be illicit substances or not, and addressing that on a major scale. How many folks need to 'escape' and find it in a bottle, smoke, injection, sex, shopping, gambling, pill... and so on?

An interesting fact is that of all the drugs about the place just about the best one for removing inhibition is ...alcohol, ice is probably the worst. Ask just about any battered/beaten victim of domestic violence, for one example, what precipitated the crime... grog, combined with an angry person.

Once you legalize any mind-altering substance at least it affords you the opportunity to manage/track and help that person. Legalizing is not a panacea, but it is an approach that at least helps us to begin to understand the larger implications and issues around mental health issues. We'll find better ways to manage the legalization so the community is minimally impacted in time but the change of mindset toward why an individual needs drugs must happen for there to be understanding and healing.

Sorry for any waffling, but this is a subject very close to my heart for many reasons.