The Climate, Environment and Energy Thread

[PaulP]

https://theconversation.com/climate-chan...say-151027

[PaulP]

https://theconversation.com/it-might-be-...ril-150745

[Thryleon]

I can't save the world, but I can save myself from too much rubbish.

I have two compost bins.

I recycle everything possible.

I red cycle my plastics.

I make sure we use the e waste cages at work for electrical waste.

If everyone does the same, we'll all go a long way to helping. 

Our rubbish bin usually has no more than two bags of rubbish every fortnight and its mainly stuff that can't be recycled.  We even buy bin liners that are made from either recycled plastic, or are biodegradable.

[capcom]

I certainly back the second link Paul posted .... but you can't patrol the Pacific.

[Thryleon]

Thinking about things, laterally I can probably/possibly do more by buying less products wrapped in plastic.  We do this as much as possible, but our number one culprit at the minute would likely be a leafy green mix when we can just buy the greens seperately.

[LP]

Thinking about things, laterally I can probably/possibly do more by buying less products wrapped in plastic.  We do this as much as possible, but our number one culprit at the minute would likely be a leafy green mix when we can just buy the greens seperately.

Firstly, in the world of many there is no such device as a single use bag!

It's going to get harder, the plastic bag ban is counterproductive in this regard.

The problem is that producers want you to get their goods home and in use in the best possible condition, free of cross contamination and spoilage. So the general trend after the check-out bag ban is more and more items coming pre-packaged. This functionally eliminates cross contamination coming from re-used fabric bags, which is seen as a huge liability by producers. It is also viewed as improving the transport condition of the goods. Ireland was the first country to ban bags, and the total plastic consumption increased after the supermarket bag ban and grown steadily.

A new threat are those re-used bags at the COVID/Checkout counter, you can expect that it won't be long before re-useable bags are banned if the policy markers are consistent, if not then why not share a mask, are those re-used bags looped over many COVID Cough Elbows? But they are probably hypocrites that will tell you your hands are dirty but that 3 year old nylon supermarket bag is fine as it is unwashed and used for everything from a lettuce to nuts and bolts from the hardware store!

The irony for me is that it seems the primary offenders of abusing single use plastic bags are wealthy leftist socialites who see a previously used bag as contaminated and trash it, it ranks marginally above a used snot rag in their life rating system. It's a bit like clothes and handbags, can't be seen wearing them twice unless your driving to the tip recycle store to donate last weeks clothes and fashions to the poor! They then paint the general public with their own shallow perspective and accuse everybody of doing the same.

Yes you guessed it, the rest of us "we to us, them to them" are all horrible horrible environmental vandals, and they'll tweet it out on the new spang-dangled rare earth repository of an 2020 iPhone because that ridiculously old 2019 model one was well, old! Put last weeks clothes on and off to the tip with that phone!

The vast bulk of the population was already re-using those "Single use bags" for secondary purposes as bin liners or some such purpose. Yes, in the world of many there is no such device as a single use bag!

[PaulP]

https://theconversation.com/3-reasons-me...ion-151836

[PaulP]

https://www.smh.com.au/environment/clima...56mfw.html

[LP]

This statistical aspect of climate change, much like the statistical aspect of virology, are the hardest things to communicate.

I like to use gambling or lottery analogies, they seem to resonate with most people because most of us aren't that lucky and we get how rare a big lottery / punting win is!

These climates events as we are experiencing them, if they are just random events, are statistically like backing three winning straight up Quadrellas in a row! It's not impossible, but out of the billions and billions of bets made each day, trillions each month and year globally, it's happened maybe once or twice! I believe just once here in Australia, in the whole history of punting a single gambler backed in three winning consecutive Quadies just once, but he did it by boxing the field in some legs, so he doesn't even qualify because it wasn't a straight up bet!

Boxing the field on some legs is like Pumping carbon into the atmosphere, increasing the chance of it happening!

[Thryleon]

My issue with the whole climate change debate is that it disregards the following:

At least five major ice ages have occurred throughout Earth's history: the earliest was over 2 billion years ago, and the most recent one began approximately 3 million years ago and continues today (yes, we live in an ice age!). Currently, we are in a warm interglacial that began about 11,000 years ago.

https://www.ncdc.noaa.gov/abrupt-climate...l%20Cycles

I have no issues with us attempting to be greener as we have caused more damage to the overall environment than any other species (I doubt you will find any other species that logs, or pollutes to the same levels as humanity) but the answer to these problems is quite simple.

Humanity is a parasite on the earth, and appears hell bent on consuming it, and until we work out that exponential growth of humanity correlates with the exponential growth of pollutants which means that the only real way forward is to live simpler and consume less, and perhaps grow slower and maybe revert back to dying younger.  Remember when living past 70 was the exception not the norm?  Now the exception is the opposite, and 70 year olds run countries.