Post Game Pondering: AFL 2020 Rd 9: Carlton vs Hawthorn

[LP]

Downhill skiers

No, it's probably a leg speed issue, we have too many who aren't able to keep up with elite runners.

It's time for Simmo, maybe sMurph as well.

Clarkson tore the top heavy team selection an new one last night, I thought it might happen in the pre-game and it eventuated. It doesn't help when 204cm McKay is penalised for an arm chop, then just 15s later at the other end O'Brien does identically the same to the front positioned Weitering and it's play on goal Hawthorn.

The disparity is glaring!

[LP]

A mate of mine says one thing only ad nauseum to me, "we lack c@#$ right across the board".  Back in the day we had it in spades.

This is part of it too, something the Robbo or Fev haters need to get their head around, it's not about being Mr Nice on and off the field, because the pricks will walk all over you on it!

Last night we saw guys like Cripps and Casboult decelerate into collisions with smaller opponents, it's untenable for players that size not to be holding their line and hurting smaller opponents. Then you see a player like Burgoyne or Sicily smashing our little blokes. 

[ElwoodBlues1]

Hawks pre game were the worst ball using team in the comp.
Didn't look like that to me and I think they have some very high quality users..
Stats can be twisted when a couple of players are very bad but you have to look closer at individuals.

[Lods]

A mate of mine says one thing only ad nauseum to me, "we lack c@#$ right across the board".  Back in the day we had it in spades.

Our big men are gentle giants.
Our smalls are much too light to impact.

[LP]

Hawks pre game were the worst ball using team in the comp.
Didn't look like that to me and I think they have some very high quality users..
Stats can be twisted when a couple of players are very bad but you have to look closer at individuals.

The difference is because the Holding the Ball implementation change last night, that enabled them to get their old structures back and working around stoppages and get some free numbers outside.

The bad Dawks ball using stats were because in previous weeks they were continually stuck in traffic under pressure.

[ElwoodBlues1]

A mate of mine says one thing only ad nauseum to me, "we lack c@#$ right across the board".  Back in the day we had it in spades.

I call it Von Trapp syndrome, by trying to avoid knob head players we have also avoided those players with mongrel.
GWS have similar issues....its held them back imo.. they have to keep reinventing Mumford and with Ward always injured that only leaves Greene who has some agro.. Great skills but Cogs, Kelly, Whitfield etc are so nice and friendly..

[PaulP]

The difference is because the Holding the Ball implementation change last night, that enabled them to get their old structures back and working around stoppages and get some free numbers outside.

The bad Dawks ball using stats were because in previous weeks they were continually stuck in traffic under pressure.

It's certainly possible IMO. As you say, his whining earlier in the season was very specific and intended to produce a desirable result.

[LP]

I call it Von Trapp syndrome, by trying to avoid knob head players we have also avoided those players with mongrel.
GWS have similar issues....its held them back imo.. they have to keep reinventing Mumford and with Ward always injured that only leaves Greene who has some agro.. Great skills but Cogs, Kelly, Whitfield etc are so nice and friendly..

I agree.

But I'd take Whitfield in a heartbeat, but he needs to come with a Greene, in fact Toby Greene might be perfect for us!

I suspect we have to move the older types on before this happens, the Simmo and sMurph types, we've too many OH&S Safe Workplace types. It leaves us as fodder for the kents, over and over again!

[Baggers]

Need to think more with the head and not frustrations. Not alot of huge decisions need to be made. Right now we're typical of up and coming sides. The good and not so good players will sort itself out in the wash.

Can't agree. I am simply commenting on presenting symptoms and facts. We're a moody side and have been for a long, long time... it's ingrained and we've been overtaken by sides who were in a similar situation to us not too long ago.

We've been up-and-coming for many years and the same symptom has persisted for at least the last 7 years... fold under pressure/ferocity from opponents, regardless of where they are on the ladder.

We and BrisVegas were in a very similar circumstance a few years back... with very similar age profiles. Their culture has changed and is definitive. Our culture has not changed, or at best is confusing but is certainly not definitive.

The 'she'll be right/lots like us/typical of up-and-comer' explanations don't wash with me - a recipe for ordinariness. And, 'The good and not so good players will sort itself out in the wash' is... well, wishy washy.

I stand by my comments that we're undisciplined and fold under pressure. We're still too nice and too introverted. What if the TT is getting the very best from this group at present?

As for your suggestion, '2 days ago we were a loss to Melbourne and a goal after the siren from being equal top of the ladder'... well that's every bit as invalid/irrelevant as my comment that we could be on the bottom. We are where we deserve to be... in the bottom section, and an erratic, inconsistent side that opponents know is fragile when the heat is brought.

Ignoring or pretending that the concerning symptoms can be explained away or not to be overly concerned about is a recipe for... well... more of the same, same old same old.

[LP]

Firstly, Pittonet is a reasonable ruckmen, he has potential to improve and can play at the level.

But, I suppose we saw last night why the Dawks let Pittonet go, their ageing fill-in/placeholder rucks turned him into a puddle.