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CV and mad panic behaviour - Printable Version

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Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - DJC - 04-20-2024

(04-18-2024, 07:15 AM)Gointocarlton link Wrote:Dunno if the rules have changed but Mrs G2G had ankle surgery last year and had to be minimum 7 weeks post covid for the surgeon to agree to perform it.

Ms DJC’s surgeon didn’t mention 7 weeks and just slotted her into the next free spot.  She is still testing negative so it may be a non issue anyway.

The anti-virals are magic and my symptoms have diminished.  I got a good night’s sleep last night and that always helps.

I was sitting in the isolation chair watching TV last night when I felt a shooting pain.  I looked down and saw a huge black bullant latched on to my little finger and pumping venom into it. 

Ice and Stingose eventually eased the pain and I guess it could have been worse but I was thinking what’s going to happen next ?



Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - ElwoodBlues1 - 05-08-2024

https://au.news.yahoo.com/astrazeneca-withdraws-covid-vaccine-worldwide-051309241.html
https://www.biopharma-reporter.com/Article/2024/04/09/Pfizer-accused-of-bringing-discredit-on-industry-with-unnecessary-vaccine-tweet#:~:text=Pfizer%20has%20been%20accused%20of,the%20height%20of%20the%20pandemic.

Who would have thought...BigPharma doing the wrong thing?

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - LP - 05-08-2024

Or the media [member=57]ElwoodBlues1[/member]‍

As far as I know Astrazeneca has never denied the rare side-effects of it's vaccine, it's a characteristic of any vaccine or medicine that there might be side-effects, some severe for a small number of people.

The media on the other hand claims pretty much everything is a side effect, the media leverages societies wide misunderstanding of chance, probability and correlation for profit, like a "5G allergy" and "Infasound Illness" from wind power! The spurious and alarmist claims about vaccines and medicines are no different.

btw., If these medicines and vaccines were 100% harmless, they would have no positive effects either, all medicines walk a like between help and harm. If we didn't have them people would still be dying from a scratch!

For myself, the real villains here are the likes of Pfizer and Moderna, not because in the real world those products aren't perfect that is expected, the problem is they continue to deny side-effects from their own products while pointing the finger at Astrazeneca, of course they do this for profit!

It's the denials that do the harm, not the product, if medical experts are aware of side-effects they can screen and manage them, but they need the information to act. Pfizer and Moderna have kept it closed, proprietary, and highly profitable.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - Baggers - 05-08-2024

Further to what the Spotted One, accurately, pointed out above...

Anecdotal, yes, but indicative: I recall when joining the Navy in '72 joining lines of young men and women to get our 'jabs'... Yellow Fever, TB... etc., etc. About 5 in all. In the 3 months of basic training I witnessed hundreds and hundreds get their jabs. Invariably, there was always 2 or 3 in that, say, 100 who had adverse reactions. Every now and then, severe.

There is barely a vaccine, indeed medication, that does not have side-effects. Generally effecting, adversely, around 2% of the population.

In time, medical science will perfect tests that will give better insight into any individuals likelihood to have adverse or on the other side of the coin, ineffectual results, to vaccines and prescription medication... and I speak from very recent experience. Only in the past 6 weeks I underwent blood tests, prescribed by my Psychiatrist (a cool and progressive dude), still in the very early stages of development to screen for, crudely put, my suitability to various PTSD medications. It was a comprehensive bank of blood tests not yet approved or funded by Medicare but forking out a coupla hundred seemed a reasonable investment. I think I've mentioned previously that I have volunteered myself for these experimentations.

And the results came in Tuesday this week! My blood work revealed suitability to some PTSD meds and not to others... obviously. Now I won't go into the complexities of what the blood work analyzed/revealed, but crudely the results showed how my liver and other organs dealt with certain meds, how my individual systems (lots of letters and numbers) dealt with the blood/brain barrier and other pathways, how I metabolised certain meds. And so on.

Results: Over the decades I've tried a number of PTSD meds and only ever had really bad reactions to 2 -- Zoloft & Prozac -- and my individual blood work revealed these two to be virtually toxic for me! I metabolized them poorly, with resultant build up. However 2 showed up as being well metabolized and tolerated giving them a good chance to do their jobs, with minimal side-effects (Escitalopram/Lexapro & Paroxetine/Aropax)... and I'm on a low / moderate dose of one of them to good effect.

Another fascinating result was my individual reaction to the benzo family (Valium, Xanax, Ativan, etc). I metabolize these really well, too well - very healthy liver. So if needed (rarely these days), I have to take a higher dose to get the required result - 5mg Valium for me? Might as well eat a tic tac... 15mg? That'll work for me like 2mg tabs work for others.

Point is, despite the best efforts from the medical folks (which has been the case over decades), some vaccines and medications will be toxic to a small % of folks, but with improved future diagnostics this will gradually be addressed right down to individual suitability.

Shameful how the media beats up panic over AZ. You can bet there are similar results -- known only behind closed doors -- showing Pfizer & Moderna to be very adverse for a small minority of folks. Bottom line: AZ/Pfizer & Moderna worked well for the greater majority of the population and saved millions of lives and prevented millions from developing severe Covid symptoms. The anti-vaxxers will have an hysterical field day with the AZ information, and the shallow end of the media will feed this hysteria.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - LP - 05-09-2024

(05-08-2024, 11:01 PM)Baggers date Wrote:The anti-vaxxers will have an hysterical field day with the AZ information, and the shallow end of the media will feed this hysteria.
Another problem is that the fear the media and anti-vax brigade propagate have very real world effects.

Of course we accept a lot of what people see on social media is fake, but that doesn't mean it won't create anxiety and doubt, and those doubts are all stresses that everyone of us is susceptible to.

A common stress for the scientists and engineers is driven by doubt, that is the "imposter syndrome", they get bashed by the media and social media fakers and start to worry, this has a real world effect just like the PTSD you describe, and much of this doubt is seeded for profit, to sell adverting, newspapers or to beg for donations / subscriptions.

For me a good first start would be to make the giants of media and social media accountable for propagating fake news, they should be liable when the fake news leads to bad outcomes.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - Baggers - 05-09-2024

(05-09-2024, 02:01 AM)LP link Wrote:A common stress for the scientists and engineers is driven by doubt, that is the "imposter syndrome", they get bashed by the media and social media fakers and start to worry, this has a real world effect just like the PTSD you describe, and much of this doubt is seeded for profit, to sell adverting, newspapers or to beg for donations / subscriptions.

Strange, but most of the scientists and engineers I know couldn't give a fig about social media, in fact their confidence borders on arrogance... which is necessary to further their work.

I suspect you might like the work of Eric Weinstein. He dissects brilliantly the challenges facing modern day innovators/thinkers/creatives/physicists/mathematicians... He's no slouch in speaking out -- and has done for decades -- about the modern day blocks and stupidity of politicians to these invaluable folks.


Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - PaulP - 05-09-2024

There are very few areas in life that don't involve a risk to benefit comparison. Apparently, 2 or 3 per 100,000 people vaccinated with AZ ended up with TTS. Granted, nobody wants to be one of those 2 or 3, but all things considered, there are a great many people who reaped the benefits of having an AZ vaccination (not to mention their close associates and loved ones) and very few that did not.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - LP - 05-09-2024

(05-09-2024, 03:03 AM)Baggers date Wrote:Strange, but most of the scientists and engineers I know couldn't give a fig about social media, in fact their confidence borders on arrogance... which is necessary to further their work.
I think they can come across like that, but it's mostly a defence mechanism, particularly if they are late career scientists and engineers.

Maybe those who seem to be a touch on a spectrum, which is often more common than you might think, can have a very myopic approach being heavily focussed on one specific area, and that can leave others thinking they are dismissive or arrogant. It's more common than you might suspect, little eccentricities that annoy everyday folk.

For example, among those I have worked with there is a surprisingly high level of dyslexia, even in those who can freely speak multiple languages.

The ones who are great orators are truly the exception, but the general public seems to expect that a brilliant scientific mind assumes a brilliant communicator, and that is far from the case!

On the issue of genuine arrogance, I find that it's very rare a good scientist is arrogant, in most cases the very good scientists doubt and question everything even their own work, which is actually the default scientific process. Make an assertion and then test it, a good scientist is always trying to prove an assertion is false. It's the bad ones that mask other deficiencies and ignore scientific process that are often caught using arrogance as a deflection mechanism.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - Baggers - 05-09-2024

(05-09-2024, 05:04 AM)LP link Wrote:I think they can come across like that, but it's mostly a defence mechanism, particularly if they are late career scientists and engineers.

Maybe those who seem to be a touch on a spectrum, which is often more common than you might think, can have a very myopic approach being heavily focussed on one specific area, and that can leave others thinking they are dismissive or arrogant. It's more common than you might suspect, little eccentricities that annoy everyday folk.

On the issue of genuine arrogance, I find that it's very rare a good scientist is arrogant, in most cases the very good scientists doubt and question everything even their own work, which is actually the default scientific process.


I think I understand where you're coming from, Spotted One... so a point of clarification. When I use the word 'arrogant' pertaining to scientists/engineers/physicists and so on, I don't see it as a negative but rather a necessity for someone pursuing their goal provided it is often balanced with humility (but not so much you get walked over) and that humility often shows itself in questioning whatever they're doing and the way they're doing it, which you mention.

Right on the money when you bring in the 'spectrum' and how these folks may appear... their people skills are often not their strong suit. Not too many amazing scientific discoveries made by people who aren't/weren't bi-polar, Asperger... etc.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - Thryleon - 05-09-2024

(05-09-2024, 04:15 AM)PaulP link Wrote:There are very few areas in life that don't involve a risk to benefit comparison. Apparently, 2 or 3 per 100,000 people vaccinated with AZ ended up with TTS. Granted, nobody wants to be one of those 2 or 3, but all things considered, there are a great many people who reaped the benefits of having an AZ vaccination (not to mention their close associates and loved ones) and very few that did not.

The issue is that the data used to support both sets of numbers were used to paint a picture.

The adverse reactions to the vaccines under reported as coincidences.  Likewise the number of people significantly impacted by covid were over stated.

The vaccine companies (all) made wide sweeping shonky claims afmbout efficacy to go with it and you end up with a scenario where most people questioned what the best outcome was going to be. 

When you strip it all bare, covid was no walk in the park.  It isn't the killer it was made out to be either but it left the general public questioning what was the lesser of two evils and real doctors were silenced on the matter and it became politicised.

Where you sit in any of it is subjective and largely determined by personal choices but I saw some extremely autocratic behaviour which I'm hoping never gets repeated.