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+--- Thread: Team selection disection (/thread-3660.html)
Re: Team selection disection - PaulP - 03-17-2018
From the Casboult Conundrum thread :
(03-17-2018, 03:27 AM)LP link Wrote:We've picked up quite a lot of depth across all segments except our forward line, so I think you are being a little pessimistic.
If you look across our list these are the players who do, can or have played midfield rotations at various times;
Dow
Murphy
Cripps
O'Brien
SPS
Kennedy
Kerridge
Lamb
Docherty
Lang
Schumaker
Plowman
Garlett
Fisher
Cunningham
Polson
Curnow
Curnow
Graham
Pickett
Byrne
Thomas
Wright
Based on VFL results, Jones could ruck and Kreuzer could play midfield, O'Shea could also get a rotation and has done so at VFL level, as well as Marchbank. But I thought Fraser had done a marvellous job at VFL level of getting Jones into the midfield with the right attitude and intent, and that is half the battle, feeling like you belong and being comfortable in the hustle and bustle.
I wouldn't be surprised to find Mullett acting as a backup for Ed Curnow as well, although if Lamb was available I'd let Lamb cover the loss of Ed and set Mullett free to attack the goals.
I haven't included the rookies Shaw or McDaid, but both are aerobically capable of being onballers and over 185cm x 85kg.
Silvagni, Williamson and Macreadie are strong enough and have sufficient aerobic capacity to do a mid-rotation as well.
Whether some of these players are successful at a rotation is more about coaching, structures and attitude than physical characteristics.
Some might argue having the correct attitude is a domain of coaching and leadership, which reminds me of those video clips showing Hodge berating Mitchell for not following his man!
Anyway this is a Casboult thread, these posts would be better of in the selection dilemma thread.
I think their success is about both physical characteristics and coaching.
Leaving aside my three protagonists (Curnow E, Kennedy and Cripps), these are my thoughts below. I might not have covered everyone you mention. If one of the above three goes down with injury, who replaces them ? Is load sharing an acceptable alternative ? Do 3 Caleb Daniels equal 1 Cripps ?
-Dow - too young - he should not be burdened so early in his career like Murph and Gibbs
-Murphy - gives his all but too small
-O'Brien - too young and not shown much to date
-SPS - maybe, but more an outside type at this moment (and a good one at that) - the bull rider stories make good copy, but we need to see more
-Kerridge - earnest and a big body, shame about the disposal, so a begrudging yes
-Lamb - not sure -seems to be a bit of a hole plugger at the moment
-Docherty - injured, but has had good spurts in the midfield, so yes
-Lang - don't know enough about him - is he more inside or outside ?
-Schumaker -??
-Plowman - no for mine - defender only for now, and very good.
-Garlett - see SPS
-Fisher - terrier and great attack, so 50/50 from me. A good example of the fight in the dog v the dog in the fight - wish he was bigger
-Cunningham - yes, if he gets it together
-Polson ??
-Curnow C - yes, but he's a one man AFL team, so he can play anywhere.
-Graham - much discussed, no need to repeat the arguments again
-Pickett - injury prone, big worry for mine playing in the guts
-Byrne - see Pickett
-Thomas - not sure about this one
-Wright - no, robbing Peter to pay Paul
-O'Shea - maybe, not great in the heat of the battle from what I can tell
-Jack S - yes, I have him ear marked as a tough inside mid if his life as a forward doesn't pan out. In fact, I would prefer it.
-Mullet - no, too timid and easily shifted. Definitely a wing /HBF IMO.
Re: Team selection disection - PaulP - 03-17-2018
And yes, you're probably right. The situation doesn't seem as bad as I had initially thought.
Re: Team selection disection - Thryleon - 04-17-2018
(03-15-2018, 01:50 AM)Thryleon link Wrote:What I was hoping to highlight, is how important the older blokes are to our side, and irrespective of how well players come on, the 1st tier will absolute be the first names written on the team sheet most weeks. The fact that there are others relatively cemented on there too, is quite irrelevant to whether or not they get selected and you will find the youngsters will only keep the mature players out if they REALLY kick on and become not just decent performers, but 4 quarter players each and every week.
We are very thin for mature, experienced top liners, and they will be in the mix for selection most weeks.
Look at this back bone, and pick your starting 22:
--BP-------------------FB-------------------BP
HBF-------------------CHB-------------------Simpson
Wing------------------Murphy------------Thomas
HFF-------------------Casboult---------------Wright
FP----------------------FF---------------------FP
Followers: Kreuzer-----E. Curnow--------------Mid
Int: 1-----------2----------3----------4
There is plenty of space for the kids and there, and whilst I can appreciate that many have pencilled in Cripps Im not writing him in here, because he is ahead of schedule and we need to be thinking a little bit more about that, when we look at our team, because the second you start dropping the likes of the above names, for kids, all of a sudden Cripps effectiveness will be reduced because he is no longer worried about his own game, but having to lead the line (Murphy, Kreuzer and Daisy are underated in this facet) and whilst Cripps might relish it, its not something we should take for granted.
Prophetic. In fact this thread has been very much all valid and proven correct. The biggest issue I have is that the folk in the stands, can see this stuff coming, yet the club has failed to entertain it.
I should keep a level head and listen to my inner self a bit more and perhaps not let my emotions get in the way of clarity of thinking.
In any case, with our injury list mounting, we need to get the following players as mainstays, and maybe give the kids a bit more VFL time:
Alex Silvagni
Sam Rowe
Andrew Phillips
Jed Lamb
Matt Shaw
Sam Kerridge
Matthew Lobbe
They don't have to all play together, but we are far too uncompetitive and might need to get a few more battle hardened bodies in the team to prevent demoralising situations that have been playing out at senior level thus far.
What I similarly worry about is that the same issues will likely play out at VFL level (demoralising performances) due to a lack of senior battle hardened bodies at this level too, so its a real balancing act that we are in unfortunately as a washout of the heavy turnover of the list.
Re: Team selection disection - LP - 04-17-2018
Phillips and Rowe look right to go to me, although Phillips shared a lot of the load with De Koning.
Lamb is one of those blokes like Ed Curnow, great in the 3rd or 4th banana role, but not effective at being the front man.
Re: Team selection disection - Thryleon - 04-17-2018
(04-17-2018, 01:44 AM)LP link Wrote:Phillips and Rowe look right to go to me, although Phillips shared a lot of the load with De Koning.
Lamb is one of those blokes like Ed Curnow, great in the 3rd or 4th banana role, but not effective at being the front man.
I agree but the weekend showed that we are very much got the balance wrong between experience and inexperience to be competitive. Lamb is 25, and has played 50 games now. We need him to provide us with leadership or prove that he can't because time is running out for these peripheral players. If he can give us the chop out we need, he will get another year next year, and if he can't then we pull the plug on him and look elsewhere.
We are going to have one of those years where we need to make decisions, and we need to know if players are able to show the right stuff to be worth persisting with.
Re: Team selection disection - ElwoodBlues1 - 04-17-2018
(04-17-2018, 01:44 AM)LP link Wrote:Phillips and Rowe look right to go to me, although Phillips shared a lot of the load with De Koning.
Lamb is one of those blokes like Ed Curnow, great in the 3rd or 4th banana role, but not effective at being the front man.
Agree..I think they will play Philips and Rowe....Nic Nat and Lycett are a decent double act and Kreuzer looks a bit jaded plus I thought Philips was one of our best
in the NB's. Probably says something we have to go back to Rowe in such a hurry but we look leaderless down back and he may give Jones and Weitering a bit more confidence
and help contain Kennedy.
Lamb will do well at VFL level because he is smart enough to find space playing on banana's but at AFL senior level he is a very ordinary player who needs to take every chance , problem is he doesnt and often misses goals or opportunities to help others score....
Re: Team selection disection - cookie2 - 04-17-2018
I like the idea of Phillips playing especially with Kreuz's fitness under a cloud. Don't think he'll play if Kreuz is fully fit but I didn't mind him at senior level tbh, until his fitness let him down. I'm sure Sam R will play as we need some more maturity and presence badly to help steady the ship. Him and Jones as the primary KDs and Weitering more in the Marchbank role.
Re: Team selection disection - Baggers - 04-17-2018
(04-17-2018, 12:23 AM)Thryleon link Wrote:Prophetic. In fact this thread has been very much all valid and proven correct. The biggest issue I have is that the folk in the stands, can see this stuff coming, yet the club has failed to entertain it.
I should keep a level head and listen to my inner self a bit more and perhaps not let my emotions get in the way of clarity of thinking.
In any case, with our injury list mounting, we need to get the following players as mainstays, and maybe give the kids a bit more VFL time:
Alex Silvagni
Sam Rowe
Andrew Phillips
Jed Lamb
Matt Shaw
Sam Kerridge
Matthew Lobbe
They don't have to all play together, but we are far too uncompetitive and might need to get a few more battle hardened bodies in the team to prevent demoralising situations that have been playing out at senior level thus far.
What I similarly worry about is that the same issues will likely play out at VFL level (demoralising performances) due to a lack of senior battle hardened bodies at this level too, so its a real balancing act that we are in unfortunately as a washout of the heavy turnover of the list.
Good stuff, 3 Leos, common sense really.
Re: Team selection disection - blue4life - 04-17-2018
(03-16-2018, 10:35 AM)kruddler link Wrote:Note: This does not mean Cripps is not an elite player
It does in my opinion.
Elite players have all of the skills of the game, which is why there are so few of them.
Re: Team selection disection - LP - 04-17-2018
(04-17-2018, 03:20 AM)blue4life link Wrote:It does in my opinion.
Elite players have all of the skills of the game, which is why there are so few of them.
I don't think there is any player who has all the skills, it's just not the case!
I think most elite players excel at a few skills, and are passable at the rest.
Older more experienced teams are better at structuring the game plan around strengths and weaknesses, they are experienced at making things happen that favour them and avoiding situations that don't!
If you think that is not true, I suggest getting hold of the heat maps for players like Martin, Ablett Jnr, Selwood, Dangerfiled, Franklin. They all avoid specific areas of the ground and certain circumstances, they play to their strengths.
To me this requirement to all-skill every player is a bit of a furphy, and it's a contributing factor for the slow progress of young players like Weitering. Maybe long term they will be better off for it, but we can never really know!