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+--- Thread: SSM Plebiscite (/thread-3461.html)
Re: Father's Day ad pulled! - mateinone - 09-05-2017
I was once for same sex marriage, I mean why not? I do believe that everyone should have the same rights
Then I became apathetic to it..
My stance was, if all the rights are the same (and those that are not, should be), then it isn't something I honestly care about that much.
Now, I won't be voting, but I am firmly in a camp where the reason is that I will not vote for the bullying I see against those who voice an opinion against. I am also absolutely against the poll in the first place..
So I will be abstaining.
Let's be clear here...
I am all for people living their lives with the person of their choice, regardless of race, religion or sex.
I am all for all people who commit to each other in a long term heterosexual or homosexual relationship (ie defacto) having the same rights as those who are married. In fact my mother and my step father are not married after 27 years together and I don't believe there is any way that the law sees them differently (and if there is, there shouldn't be) and certainly nobody in our family consider them any less 'whole' than if they were married.
I also don't believe in any religion, but I am all for allowing people religious freedom and you can bet there are many people who are against because they have firmly held religious beliefs that tell them marriage is a union between man & woman. I am firmly in the belief they should be able to hold this opinion without being ostracised for it.
I am also all for any other reason that people want to vote against as long as those reasons don't extend to hate.
To be fair, I am not actually even a fan of marriage (tried it for 17 days, didn't like it :o
), but that is my choice and I do understand the argument that those in a same sex relationship don't get the choice.I believe this poll will conclusively show that Australian's want there to be same sex marriage and will force the government to make a decision, but it should never have come to this and people should not be subjected to abuse for their opinion.
I read just yesterday how one of the mother's in the ad against same sex marriage had seen a petition go up suggesting that she should be deregistered by the AMA, thankfully the platform removed it. That is utterly ridiculous and whilst I won't be voting against, as I am not actually against, these people (the ones doing the bullying) are the reasons I won't be voting for.
And the government has a lot to answer for in this regard. It is ridiculous that they will not just tackle this issue head on. It is obvious that this year or next or in 2 years or 5 years time all couples will be able to be married, so the government should make it happen now and save the tax dollars. Rather than subject the nation to this unbinding ridiculous poll. If they are firmly against it themselves, then have the balls to state their reasons and stand by them. If that sees them outed at the next election, well they stood by their principles. If it doesn't, then okay also... but don't pass the buck!! Perhaps Turnbull can borrow the old Harry Truman sign for his desk.
Just as a footnote:
IF this poll doesn't go as planned, it will be the Donald Trump vote that does it.
It will be those who are pissed off at being told how they MUST vote and not being allowed to come to that decision on their own. I don't think it will come to that, but it is an outside possibility.
Re: Father's Day ad pulled! - PaulP - 09-06-2017
Perhaps the marriage equality lobby has had enough of trying to be neutral, civil etc., and can't be bothered pandering to idiots any longer. This "debate", in various guises and forms, has been going on for decades. Even the most patient group or individual would be fed up by now. I don't blame them for getting the sh1ts.
I hope you reconsider your position and vote MIO.
Re: Father's Day ad pulled! - mateinone - 09-06-2017
Do you blame them for going out of their way to attack people for their views or beliefs?
Isn't that exactly the thing we should be fighting against?
Getting the sh1ts doesn't allow for people to be ar$eholes.
I am sticking by not voting for all the reasons outline Paul and the moment I thought it was
A) Binding
B) Done without prejudice for or against peoples right to vote based on their own guidelines.
Then I would vote yes.
Re: Father's Day ad pulled! - PaulP - 09-06-2017
(09-06-2017, 01:56 AM)mateinone link Wrote:Do you blame them for going out of their way to attack people for their views or beliefs?
Isn't that exactly the thing we should be fighting against?
Getting the sh1ts doesn't allow for people to be ar$eholes.
I am sticking by not voting for all the reasons outline Paul and the moment I thought it was
A) Binding
B) Done without prejudice for or against peoples right to vote based on their own guidelines.
Then I would vote yes.
That's your choice, matey. As much as this whole plebiscite is a sham, it is currently the only thing we have to voice our opinions.
The point I'm making is that all of us have limits. The marriage equality lobby has let fly because they've had enough. As I said, this has been going on for decades. Sometimes you have to call out an idiotic opinion / position exactly for what it is. There is such a thing as provocation, even provocation masquerading as decades of stalling, "debates", etc.
Re: Father's Day ad pulled! - LP - 09-06-2017
There are no excuses for physical or verbal abuse.
Two wrongs do not make a right, leave that to the anarchists!
Re: Father's Day ad pulled! - PaulP - 09-06-2017
(09-06-2017, 02:07 AM)LP link Wrote:There are no excuses for physical or verbal abuse.
Two wrongs do not make a right, leave that to the anarchists!
Good lord. Somebody called somebody else a bad name. The Constitution is collapsing.
The conservative lobby hold most of the power. The playing field is not level at all. But sure, let's "debate" this topic for another 100 years. We don't want to rush any decisions.
Re: Father's Day ad pulled! - LP - 09-06-2017
(09-06-2017, 02:17 AM)PaulP link Wrote:Good lord. Somebody called somebody else a bad name. The Constitution is collapsing.
The conservative lobby hold most of the power. The playing field is not level at all. But sure, let's "debate" this topic for another 100 years. We don't want to rush any decisions.
Yes they did, it's called bullying, and the very side doing the name calling frequently claims they are victims of it!
There is an old, a very old saying; "The smeller is the fella!"
Re: Father's Day ad pulled! - PaulP - 09-06-2017
(09-06-2017, 02:23 AM)LP link Wrote:Yes they did, it's called bullying, and the very side doing the name calling claims they are victims of it!
There is an old, a very old saying; "The smeller is the fella!"
The point is that, given enough provocation, the gay lobby will occasionally lose its cool. For decades they have defended themselves against all sorts of conservative BS - that their lifestyle is immoral, against God and the Church, that they want to turn the kiddies into poofters and lesbians, that they support pedophilia etc. The fact that they will lose their rag occasionally is perfectly understandable IMO, and should not in any way be used as an excuse to avoid the wider issues at play.
Re: Father's Day ad pulled! - mateinone - 09-06-2017
Paul
On neither side is bullying an okay practise and I agree that those fed up have often been bullied along the process, but you can't take that out on someone expressing an opinion.
Their is a platform to try and facilitate change and it can be done respectfully by all parties.
Otherwise people are going to get their backs up.
If this is handled correctly the change will occur (I think it will regardless), but there is absolutely no excuse for bullying at all.
Re: Father's Day ad pulled! - PaulP - 09-06-2017
(09-06-2017, 02:29 AM)mateinone link Wrote:Paul
On neither side is bullying an okay practise and I agree that those fed up have often been bullied along the process, but you can't take that out on someone expressing an opinion.
Their is a platform to try and facilitate change and it can be done respectfully by all parties.
Otherwise people are going to get their backs up.
If this is handled correctly the change will occur (I think it will regardless), but there is absolutely no excuse for bullying at all.
There's no excuse for it, but i can understand why it happens. And tbh, I empathize with them.