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+--- Thread: The Climate, Environment and Energy Thread (/thread-4986.html)
Re: The Climate, Environment and Energy Thread - Gointocarlton - 10-17-2022
(10-17-2022, 06:48 AM)ElwoodBlues1 link Wrote:Im 50/50 GTC...my brain says the next car we buy has to be some form of EV either Hybrid, PHEV or Full electric but when you sit down and do the maths, pros and cons its hard to justify the expense. You look at the resale value on a EV with old batteries for example and it isnt going to be great and we just dont do the Km's anymore.EVs won't cut it for what I need EOS. They can't take away what I need.
Also do you want to be stuck with a combustion only vehicle in 5-7 years time when Governments are going to be insisting you go some form of EV and making life harder for non EV cars/owners.
Long gone are the days when you keep a car for ten plus years like you and I might have done in the past...with tech changing/safety equipment getting more advanced etc you feel more inclined to upgrade to keep your family safer and thats how cunning car makers market and make their cars now...what to do?
Re: The Climate, Environment and Energy Thread - DJC - 10-17-2022
(10-16-2022, 05:23 PM)Thryleon link Wrote:the same applies to renewables about the grid and storage of energy.
Its still moving forward.
Im not arguing right vs wrong here, I'm saying the bean counters don't always measure things with saving the most amount beans, rather they count beans with politics involved, and will waste more beans for many reasons not to do with being efficient with the beans.
We all know that a nuclear power plant is unwanted on anyone's doorstep and thats the main blocker behind any of them being built and consequently a political loser which is the main blocker behind them being built.
Leaving Australia aside with its ban on nuclear power, it's economics that is stopping investment in nuclear power. The 2019 World Nuclear Industry Status report gives the following energy production costs:
>Solar power ranges from $36 in to $44 per megawatt hour (MWh);
>Onshore wind power comes in at $29–$56 per MWh; and
>Nuclear energy costs between $112 and $189.
On top of that, since 2009 the average construction time for reactors worldwide was just under 10 years, and that's well above the World Nuclear Association's estimate of between 5 and 8.5 years. That's a major drawback when stabilising the climate is urgent.
Apart from the slowness of nuclear power station builds, it no longer meets technical or operational needs that low-carbon options meet much faster and with lower initial and ongoing costs. Capital investment reflects that. For example, in 2018, China invested $91 billion in renewables but just $6.5 billion in nuclear ... and there's no consideration of whether the population wants or doesn't want a nuclear power plant on their doorstep.
It’s worth adding that China has just decided to increase its coal-fired electricity generation capacity. The CCP doesn’t give a fat rat’s clacker about climate change, international obligations and/or the wishes of the people. It goes with the cheapest options and they are renewables and coal, not nuclear.
Re: The Climate, Environment and Energy Thread - cookie2 - 10-17-2022
I have looked at swapping my car for a new one a number of times in the past couple of years but I just don't seem to be able to make a good case, apart from the temptation of getting into a bright shiny new toy.
I don't think EVs are quite there yet and I am reluctant to invest significant funds into a new internal combustion model at this point. I don't travel long distances these days so I think I'll just keep running the old bomb for as long as it keeps going. It's still low Ks and has good service history so fingers crossed it's good for a couple of more years.
Re: The Climate, Environment and Energy Thread - Baggers - 10-17-2022
(10-17-2022, 09:13 AM)cookie2 link Wrote:I have looked at swapping my car for a new one a number of times in the past couple of years but I just don't seem to be able to make a good case, apart from the temptation of getting into a bright shiny new toy.
I don't think EVs are quite there yet and I am reluctant to invest significant funds into a new internal combustion model at this point. I don't travel long distances these days so I think I'll just keep running the old bomb for as long as it keeps going. It's still low Ks and has good service history so fingers crossed it's good for a couple of more years.
We find ourselves in a similar dilemma, Fluffy One.
Mrs Baggers and I have our own cars, hers is 7 years old and has done 63,000kms and mine is 11 years old and has done 112,000kms and both are purring along nicely. Mine's a 3 litre AWD turbo and hers a 2 litre turbo. We considered trading both in on a one new car... but... hybrid? Internal combustion? EV? I think we're going to wait another 12 months... but the temptation to get a shiny new toy, as you say, is so very tempting!
Re: The Climate, Environment and Energy Thread - Macca37 - 10-17-2022
(10-17-2022, 09:13 AM)cookie2 link Wrote:I have looked at swapping my car for a new one a number of times in the past couple of years but I just don't seem to be able to make a good case, apart from the temptation of getting into a bright shiny new toy.
I don't think EVs are quite there yet and I am reluctant to invest significant funds into a new internal combustion model at this point. I don't travel long distances these days so I think I'll just keep running the old bomb for as long as it keeps going. It's still low Ks and has good service history so fingers crossed it's good for a couple of more years.
I made the decision to buy a new ICE vehicle last year and took delivery in November - a 2 litre turbo.
No doubt owning an EV would give me a feeling of keeping up to date with technology but I see far too many problems with every day motoring.
Just to mention a few: how long will it be before the infrastructure is in place which will enable millions of cars to be re-charged at home at night, and how will it be financed? What will be the infrastructure and its cost which will enable cars parked in units and on every suburban road in our cities to be charged every night?
Today it took me under five minutes to fill my tank, pay the attendant, and drive away. How many thousands of charging units will be required, and at what cost, to allow motorists to charge their batteries during the day to 80 percent charge in a time remotely close to filling a petrol engine car?
The overseas experience seems to be that approximately 50 percent of charging units are out of order at any one time and can take several days to be brought online again.
I believe that by the time these problems are solved I will be too old to worry about driving.
Re: The Climate, Environment and Energy Thread - Gointocarlton - 10-17-2022
(10-17-2022, 12:39 PM)Macca37 link Wrote:I made the decision to buy a new ICE vehicle last year and took delivery in November - a 2 litre turbo.If we think the price of the EV is high, wait till you start getting gouged for all the infrastructure you mention above.
No doubt owning an EV would give me a feeling of keeping up to date with technology but I see far too many problems with every day motoring.
Just to mention a few: how long will it be before the infrastructure is in place which will enable millions of cars to be re-charged at home at night, and how will it be financed? What will be the infrastructure and its cost which will enable cars parked in units and on every suburban road in our cities to be charged every night?
Today it took me under five minutes to fill my tank, pay the attendant, and drive away. How many thousands of charging units will be required, and at what cost, to allow motorists to charge their batteries during the day to 80 percent charge in a time remotely close to filling a petrol engine car?
The overseas experience seems to be that approximately 50 percent of charging units are out of order at any one time and can take several days to be brought online again.
I believe that by the time these problems are solved I will be too old to worry about driving.
Re: The Climate, Environment and Energy Thread - LP - 10-17-2022
(10-17-2022, 09:07 AM)DJC date Wrote:Leaving Australia aside with its ban on nuclear power, it's economics that is stopping investment in nuclear power. The 2019 World Nuclear Industry Status report gives the following energy production costs:You do realize this is a false flag entity, the name is a direct contradiction to the interests of those on the panel, they masquerade as a nuclear industry panel when they are in fact an assemblage of nuclear abolitionists claiming to be impartial.
That panels behaviour is the exact thing that has turned me away from green and renewable energy, a lie is a lie no matter which direction it comes from.
They are the nuclear industry version of the Australian Vaccination Network! :o
Re: The Climate, Environment and Energy Thread - DJC - 10-18-2022
(10-17-2022, 09:16 PM)LP link Wrote:You do realize this is a false flag entity, the name is a direct contradiction to the interests of those on the panel, they masquerade as a nuclear industry panel when they are in fact an assemblage of nuclear abolitionists claiming to be impartial.
That panels behaviour is the exact thing that has turned me away from green and renewable energy, a lie is a lie no matter which direction it comes from.
They are the nuclear industry version of the Australian Vaccination Network! :o
I think you may be stretching things just a tad there LP
The WNISR is up front about its opposition to nuclear power. However, that doesn't detract from the data presented in its reports, most of which is drawn from sources such as nuclear power generator companies' annual reports, the IAEA, Nuclear Energy International magazine, the Economic Commission for Europe, the US Department of State, White House Fact Sheets, and other national governments' status reports. The WNISR even presents a comparison of its findings with those of the IAEA so you can drill down and satisfy yourself about the reliability of conflicting data sets.
Re: The Climate, Environment and Energy Thread - LP - 10-18-2022
(10-18-2022, 01:29 AM)DJC date Wrote:I think you may be stretching things just a tad there LPIt's about the metrics used, it not about the validity of the data as most of it is probably accurate, it's just not the full picture. Both sides of the debate can include or exclude whatever they like in various reports and then claim the conclusion is definitive.
The WNISR is up front about its opposition to nuclear power. However, that doesn't detract from the data presented in its reports, most of which is drawn from sources such as nuclear power generator companies' annual reports, the IAEA, Nuclear Energy International magazine, the Economic Commission for Europe, the US Department of State, White House Fact Sheets, and other national governments' status reports. The WNISR even presents a comparison of its findings with those of the IAEA so you can drill down and satisfy yourself about the reliability of conflicting data sets.
Reality is, both sides of the debate are as bad as each other.
Re: The Climate, Environment and Energy Thread - Thryleon - 10-18-2022
Using these flaky numbers to calculate costs of power generation is a bit flawed. For instance every renewable doesn't calculate based on retiring and the carbon footprint to manufacture. Apparently you can make renewable energy with no pollutants.
Meanwhile over at nuclear energy land how many carbon offsets need to be calculated to gather the cost of said energy?
Oh look, one is more expensive than the other.
Its a junk comparison IMHO and fails to tell the story.