Carlton Supporters Club
CV and mad panic behaviour - Printable Version

+- Carlton Supporters Club (http://new.carltonsc.com)
+-- Forum: Social Club (http://new.carltonsc.com/forum-6.html)
+--- Forum: Blah-Blah Bar (http://new.carltonsc.com/forum-23.html)
+--- Thread: CV and mad panic behaviour (/thread-4651.html)

Pages: 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38 39 40 41 42 43 44 45 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 55 56 57 58 59 60 61 62 63 64 65 66 67 68 69 70 71 72 73 74 75 76 77 78 79 80 81 82 83 84 85 86 87 88 89 90 91 92 93 94 95 96 97 98 99 100 101 102 103 104 105 106 107 108 109 110 111 112 113 114 115 116 117 118 119 120 121 122 123 124 125 126 127 128 129 130 131 132 133 134 135 136 137 138 139 140 141 142 143 144 145 146 147 148 149 150 151 152 153 154 155 156 157 158 159 160 161 162 163 164 165 166 167 168 169 170 171 172 173 174 175 176 177 178 179 180 181 182 183 184 185 186 187 188 189 190 191 192 193 194 195 196 197 198 199 200 201 202 203 204 205 206 207 208 209 210 211 212 213 214 215 216 217 218 219 220 221 222 223 224 225 226 227 228 229 230 231 232 233 234 235 236 237 238 239 240 241 242 243 244 245 246 247 248 249 250 251 252 253 254 255 256 257 258 259 260 261 262 263 264 265 266 267 268 269 270 271 272 273 274 275 276 277 278 279 280 281 282 283 284 285 286 287 288 289 290 291 292 293 294 295 296 297 298 299 300 301 302 303 304 305 306 307 308 309 310 311 312 313 314 315 316 317 318 319 320 321 322 323 324 325 326 327 328 329 330 331 332 333 334 335 336 337 338 339 340 341 342 343 344 345 346 347 348 349 350 351 352 353 354 355 356 357 358 359 360 361 362 363 364 365 366 367 368 369 370 371 372 373 374 375 376 377 378 379 380 381 382 383 384 385 386 387 388 389 390 391 392 393 394 395 396 397 398 399 400 401 402 403 404 405 406 407 408 409 410 411 412 413 414 415 416 417 418 419 420 421 422 423 424 425 426 427 428 429 430 431 432 433 434 435 436 437 438 439 440 441 442 443 444 445 446 447 448 449 450 451 452 453 454 455 456 457 458 459 460 461 462 463 464 465 466 467 468 469 470 471 472 473 474 475 476 477 478 479 480 481 482 483 484 485 486 487 488 489 490 491 492 493 494 495 496 497 498 499 500 501 502 503 504 505 506 507 508 509 510 511 512 513 514 515 516 517 518 519 520 521 522 523 524 525 526 527 528 529 530 531 532 533 534 535 536 537 538 539 540 541 542 543 544 545 546 547 548 549 550 551 552 553 554 555 556 557 558 559 560 561 562 563 564 565 566 567 568 569 570 571 572 573 574 575 576 577 578 579 580 581 582 583 584 585 586 587 588 589 590 591 592 593 594 595 596 597 598 599 600 601 602 603 604 605 606 607 608 609 610 611 612 613 614 615 616 617 618 619 620 621 622 623 624 625 626 627 628 629 630 631 632 633 634 635 636 637 638 639 640 641 642 643 644 645 646 647 648 649 650 651 652 653 654 655 656 657 658 659 660 661 662 663 664 665 666 667 668 669 670 671 672 673 674 675 676 677 678 679 680 681 682 683 684 685 686 687 688 689 690 691 692 693 694 695 696 697 698 699 700 701 702 703 704 705 706 707 708 709 710 711 712 713 714 715 716 717 718 719 720 721 722 723 724 725 726 727 728 729 730 731 732 733 734 735 736 737 738 739 740 741 742 743

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - LP - 11-13-2020

Death Rates
Even worse behaviour still, is when PCR test results are deliberately cross compiled with diagnostic results and / or hospitalisations in an attempt to paint deaths rates as declining. PCR forms just one part of diagnosis, it says test here, to which other tests confirm a case! As the rate of confirmed cases rise, the relative number of hospitalisations to PCR tests will drop, due to PCR testing delivering options for early detection, detection and isolation of asymptomatic spreaders, recovered mild cases, and early intervention. But this is Deaths/PCR test number is misrepresented as declining death rates.

However death rates as a percentage of hospitalisation Deaths/Hospitalisation are pretty much a fixed ratio globally, it's a number reached that point where small local variations do not make much difference because the average is being calculated over such a big figure, and in the absence of strong lock-downs and good social distancing practises there will be more hospitalisations resulting in more deaths.

Even News Ltd have conceded and published the real figures recently, you could have knocked me over with a feather, I suppose they'v lost their biggest fan!

As Europe and the USA burns, the sceptics must be swallowing ground teeth while eating their bomb shelter wheatbix, and how do the "preppers" reconcile the conspiracy given they so readily propagate it before locking themselves down, disappearing regularly then periodically surfacing to post another brace of fake claims and false hypothesis before scuttling underground again! The Internets version of rock-throwers!

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - Mav - 11-13-2020

(11-13-2020, 01:58 AM)capcom link Wrote:It is a big difference given the relative distances and ease of travel access.  Moreover, our comparatively tiny population; i.e. Canada and the United States radically different death rates.  Multitude of reasons
Really? Americans might believe we’re all Crocodile Dundees who walk around in rural areas while kangaroos hop around close by. We know different. About 80% or more of us live in major coastal cities. These cities aren’t greatly different to US cities. Much of their country also has low-density country areas. Hell, the State of Wyoming only has a total population of about 500,000. Initially, the rural-dominated Red States were fairly untouched by Covid but now they’re in it up to their eyeballs.

Maybe Canada handled Covid much better than the US? After all, being a much colder country on the whole, its population was much more likely to congregate inside to take refuge from the snow and wind and the US has found that winter has been a problem for this reason. Maybe Canadians wear masks?

As for the ease of travel access, Australia had considerable tourist and business traffic, including direct flights from China. We had to deal with cruise ships. The ease of travel access is irrelevant. The only issue is whether there was an inflow of people from overseas. The virus has never cared whether those people have had to travel for days, hours or minutes. Once established in a population a small number of cases can explode exponentially. It’s then a question of whether authorities can suppress it successfully. The US has failed spectacularly.

Only Trumpists would try to blame Mexicans for bringing Covid across the border. Their cases came from people flying in from Europe and China to NY and other major cities. The US could have restricted that travel but chose not to do it. Even the China ban was porous as Americans were able to go there and back at will. Some 40,000 people flew in from China after the ban was imposed.

Simply put, pandemics cross water given air and sea travel. Whether it runs rampant depends on the response to it.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - capcom - 11-13-2020

We can toss around figures all day .... US have near on 14 times our population, UK more than double.  New York alone 8.5 million. 

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - PaulP - 11-13-2020

(11-13-2020, 04:00 AM)capcom link Wrote:We can toss around figures all day .... US have near on 14 times our population, UK more than double.  New York alone 8.5 million. 

14x the population, but about 260x the covid death rates.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - PaulP - 11-13-2020

I agree with Chris Hedges and Richard Wolff - the handling of the pandemic by the US government was a big factor, but the for-profit-only healthcare system is also culpable. The only developed country that doesn't have universal healthcare.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - LP - 11-13-2020

(11-13-2020, 01:58 AM)capcom date Wrote:It is a big difference given the relative distances and ease of travel access.  Moreover, our comparatively tiny population; i.e. Canada and the United States radically different death rates.  Multitude of reasons
Death rates, as a count of total deaths over the total case count, tends to hover either side of 3%, excluding one or two outlier countries.

Canada is 3.8%
USA is about 2.3%

I suppose when you talk about deaths 1.5% difference could be considered radical, but you have to keep in mind it is an average about a mean that is influenced heavily by reporting standards and politics.

The USA is a bit contrary, because states report differently dependant on politics there is no Federal standard, just like there is no Federal standard for reporting in Australia which is even more ironic given COVID is a Federal responsibility for Australia. ( I know I hear the naysayers, but if you think it's a State issue, ask yourself why the Feds bought vaccines without consulting the states who will basically buy them off the Feds. Maybe they just did it out of the goodness of Frydenberg's heart! ;D )

A good example of variability, if you die from a heart condition because you can't get into a COVID full hospital, some areas report you as a cardiac failure while others report as a COVID death, both are correct but political preferences mean most choose to report one or the other including the deniers. But it's no different than when people fleeing a bush fire die in a car crash, it's a death due to the bush fire and a road fatality. Correct reporting lists both, not one or the other, like falling off the ladder getting out of your burning 2nd story bedroom is a death from fire and ladder fall!

The global average barely deviates from 3% as each new week passes.

The huge variation region to region is deaths per million of population, which is basically a function of intervention strategy over lethality.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - capcom - 11-13-2020

Yep LP ... agree with all that


Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - PaulP - 11-17-2020

https://theconversation.com/moderna-follows-pfizer-with-exciting-vaccine-news-how-to-read-these-dramatic-developments-149935

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - LP - 11-17-2020

(11-17-2020, 12:27 AM)PaulP date Wrote:https://theconversation.com/moderna-follows-pfizer-with-exciting-vaccine-news-how-to-read-these-dramatic-developments-149935
COVID treatment looks almost certainly to be administered like Influenza vaccine, so we shouldn't be surprised to find out the vaccination is going to be annual. I suspect this is why Vic is building a new billion dollar production facility, plus the transport/logistical issues. I note when COVID started and the transport restrictions hit very large shipments of Influenza vaccine went bad sitting stuck in transit.

People like Trump and Boris want to be very careful in declaring their immunity to soon, firstly because there are different SARs-CoV-2 strains and there is no direct evidence yet getting one delivers immunity against the others, secondly almost all reputable studies so far have shown a massive decline in anti-body counts over a 4 to 6 month period after any infection. That is on parity with Influenza immunity, which requires annual vaccination to be given at the right moment to get people through the high risk period.

Re: CV and mad panic behaviour - ElwoodBlues1 - 11-17-2020

Its back on in Adelaide, Covid panickers hording and sending us back to the dark days when this started.
https://au.yahoo.com/news/got-kidding-coles-shopper-blasted-selfish-act-215119274.html