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+--- Thread: Goaltracker (/thread-3224.html)
Re: Goaltracker - laj - 06-03-2017
(06-03-2017, 01:14 AM)PaulP link Wrote:Any coach with even half a brain will hopefully tell you that both defense and offense wins you games and flags. If defense was king, Ross Lyon would have a few flags by now.
Lyon's unlucky not to have a few flags. A lucky toe poke on 2009, and shocking bounce in 2010 and was only 15pts away in 2013.
Every coach will tell you though it all starts with defence. There's a very good reason Bolton is starting with defence first. It's what Roos did too. Roos was a premiership coach. Malthouse always focused on defence first, and i'm not talking about his days at Carlton. Offense is important obviously as scoring is pretty damn handy but it defence first.
Re: Goaltracker - Lods - 06-03-2017
http://www.theroar.com.au/2014/08/13/defence-may-be-the-best-form-of-attack-but-attack-is-the-best-method-of-winning-premierships/
Re: Goaltracker - PaulP - 06-03-2017
(06-03-2017, 10:43 AM)Lods link Wrote:http://www.theroar.com.au/2014/08/13/defence-may-be-the-best-form-of-attack-but-attack-is-the-best-method-of-winning-premierships/
The defense rests.
Re: Goaltracker - Lods - 06-03-2017
I guess though it comes back to..... do you concentrate on tightening up the defence as the first part of the puzzle and once you've stabilised that area then work towards developing the scoring power as the finishing touch.
That seems to be the path we're taking.
Re: Goaltracker - PaulP - 06-03-2017
(06-03-2017, 10:52 AM)Lods link Wrote:I guess though it comes back to..... do you concentrate on tightening up the defence as the first part of the puzzle and once you've stabilised that area then work towards developing the scoring power as the finishing touch.
That seems to be the path we're taking.
I'm guessing which line gets developed first partly depends on the coach's ideas and also on who is available to draft / trade at any given time. I can't believe the club would pass up a gun KPF simply because they're focusing on the back 6.
I don't see why they can't be developed simultaneously, and I don't see any logic to the fact that the defense must come first. Frankly I don't particularly care. Whenever the reset is finished, I just want to see a team that can kick 100-110 points on a regular basis.
Re: Goaltracker - Thryleon - 06-03-2017
(06-03-2017, 12:05 AM)sydneybluesfan link Wrote:That's an interesting example - Port had 64 i50's and 35+shots on goal. The fact that they couldn't convert and only kicked 13 goals is more about their terrible conversion and Hawthorns extra numbers in defence rather than a lack of scoring power. They should have easily kicked 20 goals based on their numbers alone.
I'm curious at what stage you do get worried about our attack? We've been bottom 4 for scoring for the last 3 years, and dead last right now - our kids up forward have some 'potential' but none have even had a breakout game that says they can kick goals at the level. Our key forward is a 27 yo who has only played 80 game and averages a goal a game and less than 10 disposals - in a forwardline where he has no competition. Do we wait until end 2018 or 2019 before we wake up to the fact that our lack of forwards means we will never move off the bottom rungs of the ladder?
Don't you see its a subjective stat??
Three teams kicked over 14 goals for the round.
Two of them played against each other in a shoot-out with one kicking 18, the other 15.
Leigh Mathews said, first to 15 goals wins.
Adelaide's much revered forwardline was useless this week.
Don't get me wrong, I think we do need some improvement in our forwardline but I can see enough improvement in jack Silvagni and Charlie Curnow to suggest that they will do better in future. I also believe that with some different players we could kick more goals.
Why I'm not worried is that we are getting in there often enough but not hitting the scoreboard as often as we could be as we turn it over entering our fifty by hitting up speculative targets or not playing the percentages. We are trending upwards here too.
What I'm thinking is that the we don't kick enough goals is alarmist. Goals are the finishing of work. An example of why I'm not worried is that if we hit better targets inside forward fifty we could kick more goals with our current cattle. To suggest that they won't improve that is false, and that's without factoring growth or recruitment.
Re: Goaltracker - LP - 06-04-2017
(06-03-2017, 12:05 AM)sydneybluesfan link Wrote:Our key forward is a 27 yo who has only played 80 game and averages a goal a game and less than 10 disposals - in a forwardline where he has no competition...........
SBF.........Shhhhh...Shhhhhh....., [img width=50]https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.clipartbest.com%2Fcliparts%2F4c9%2Fbqo%2F4c9bqoncE.png&f=1[/img]
you must whisper those facts or you'll be labelled a Casboult basher! :o
In fairness to Casboult, his first 80 games is about the same as Betts!
OMG, could Casboult become the highest rated small forward in the AFL? ;D
Re: Goaltracker - sydneybluesfan - 06-04-2017
(06-03-2017, 11:00 PM)Thryleon link Wrote:Don't you see its a subjective stat??Of course this is largely subjective, and everyone is perfectly entitled to their opinion. My position is based primarily on stats that I think are often overlooked.
Three teams kicked over 14 goals for the round.
Two of them played against each other in a shoot-out with one kicking 18, the other 15.
Leigh Mathews said, first to 15 goals wins.
Adelaide's much revered forwardline was useless this week.
Don't get me wrong, I think we do need some improvement in our forwardline but I can see enough improvement in jack Silvagni and Charlie Curnow to suggest that they will do better in future. I also believe that with some different players we could kick more goals.
Why I'm not worried is that we are getting in there often enough but not hitting the scoreboard as often as we could be as we turn it over entering our fifty by hitting up speculative targets or not playing the percentages. We are trending upwards here too.
What I'm thinking is that the we don't kick enough goals is alarmist. Goals are the finishing of work. An example of why I'm not worried is that if we hit better targets inside forward fifty we could kick more goals with our current cattle. To suggest that they won't improve that is false, and that's without factoring growth or recruitment.
If people think that being second last in inside 50's and 10% lower than this time last year is 'getting the ball in enough' then I'll go heave. Our conversion of inside 50's into scoring shots and goals is about the league average. Where I disagree with many though is the assertion that we will 'naturally improve' or the coaches will suddenly switch tack and we will suddenly become much better in attack, despite a 60 game trendline that shows no improvement at all. There is a bit of potential in a few of our youngsters, but we individually and collectively we have delivered very little in attack all year.
A competent forwardline begins with having a bunch of good forwards on your list, with a mix of experienced and developing players - just like we have with the defence and midfield. Until we get more AFL standard forwards onto our list, or start playing the ones we do have, then I can't see how we improve!
Re: Goaltracker - sydneybluesfan - 06-04-2017
(06-04-2017, 02:07 AM)LP link Wrote:SBF.........Shhhhh...Shhhhhh....., [img width=50]https://images.duckduckgo.com/iu/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.clipartbest.com%2Fcliparts%2F4c9%2Fbqo%2F4c9bqoncE.png&f=1[/img]Ha Ha - like for many here Casboult to me is the most frustrating player on our list. It's an interesting comparison, but Betts played 80 games after his first 4 years and was improving his output each year. The big thing with Betts is how he has developed and gotten better nearly every year he has played. Playing in a good side with a very talented forwardline has also [unsurprisingly] helped him a lot at the Crows.
you must whisper those facts or you'll be labelled a Casboult basher! :o
In fairness to Casboult, his first 80 games is about the same as Betts!
OMG, could Casboult become the highest rated small forward in the AFL? ;D
Cas on the other hand is simply not smart enough as a footballer to ever be a good forward. He is an awesome contested mark, but is just in the wrong place at the wrong time way too often to ever build a forwardline around, as he is also often putting the other players out of position as well.
Re: Goaltracker - flyboy77 - 06-04-2017
(06-04-2017, 03:08 AM)sydneybluesfan link Wrote:Ha Ha - like for many here Casboult to me is the most frustrating player on our list. It's an interesting comparison, but Betts played 80 games after his first 4 years and was improving his output each year. The big thing with Betts is how he has developed and gotten better nearly every year he has played. Playing in a good side with a very talented forwardline has also [unsurprisingly] helped him a lot at the Crows.
Cas on the other hand is simply not smart enough as a footballer to ever be a good forward. He is an awesome contested mark, but is just in the wrong place at the wrong time way too often to ever build a forwardline around, as he is also often putting the other players out of position as well.
no, the mids put the forward line out of position, as the forwards never have any idea when the bll is actually going to (maybe) get moved into F50.
Slow ball movement kills everything, forwards and scoring in particular.