+- Carlton Supporters Club (http://new.carltonsc.com)
+-- Forum: Princes Park (http://new.carltonsc.com/forum-4.html)
+--- Forum: Robert Heatley Stand (http://new.carltonsc.com/forum-14.html)
+--- Thread: Winning isn't everything (/thread-4293.html)
Re: Winning isn't everything - DJC - 05-15-2019
(05-15-2019, 09:37 AM)LP link Wrote:Hard when you cannot send out a runner to the kids, Clarkson couldn't even stop us scoring until after 1/2 time!
The biggest change a change of coach would bring is a media honeymoon period for the new coach as an excuse for further loses.
Clarkson could have run onto the field and king hit Grundy midway through the third quarter. That would have given us another W :
Re: Winning isn't everything - Tragic - 05-15-2019
Since we're talking about winning, we may as well put a number on it. Before the season started my general thoughts were -
4 + minimum
6 + good
8 + excellent
10 + tell 'em they're dreaming
I think i might have said in an old post I was expecting 6 - 8 wins. Only 5 to go !
If we ended up with 4 or 5 I might be inclined to add 1 for all the close ones combined, just to take into account the general improvement (thus far).
My only concern is how we play out the year. For the first time we have no excuse for young bodies tiring late in the season, as we now only have a handful of first 22 in their first or second season. A good match committee who wanted to win games would swap them out if they showed signs of tiring and costing us games. The rest of the season is the true test of how good our coaches are, and how committed our players are. If they can't get another 3 wins, which is my minimum expectation, then something is wrong with one or both of those mobs. While unproven, we have a better team than 1 - 3 wins would indicate, of that I am sure.
Re: Winning isn't everything - flyboy77 - 05-15-2019
My little fella - Grade 1 this year - had a major melt down before class started on Tuesday. Which is not like him at all.
When quizzed by his mother why he wasn't taking his water bottle into his classroom like all the others, he melted down and said he didn't want his class mates to know he went for Carlton! :-[ :-[
(his water bottle is a charlie's crew bottle with his name on it!)
That's why I want wins on the board more than anything!!!!
Re: Winning isn't everything - Lods - 05-15-2019
(05-15-2019, 11:31 PM)flyboy77 link Wrote:My little fella - Grade 1 this year - had a major melt down before class started on Tuesday. Which is not like him at all.
When quizzed by his mother why he wasn't taking his water bottle into his classroom like all the others, he melted down and said he didn't want his class mates to know he went for Carlton! :-[ :-[
(his water bottle is a charlie's crew bottle with his name on it!)
That's why I want wins on the board more than anything!!!!
That's a little sad...
But let him know there's change 'a comin'
I used to hate going to school after a Carlton loss...
Once or twice a year it gave the other kids an opportunity to have a shot at me.
Hopefully by the time he hits primary school his problem will be the same as the old days.
And in the days after the flags....well, for a few days you rule the school.
He may still have to hide his bottle....the other kids will want to pinch it.
Re: Winning isn't everything - LP - 05-15-2019
(05-15-2019, 11:31 PM)flyboy77 link Wrote:My little fella - Grade 1 this year - had a major melt down before class started on Tuesday. Which is not like him at all.
When quizzed by his mother why he wasn't taking his water bottle into his classroom like all the others, he melted down and said he didn't want his class mates to know he went for Carlton! :-[ :-[
(his water bottle is a charlie's crew bottle with his name on it!)
That's why I want wins on the board more than anything!!!!
Kids can be cruel.
My youngest chose the Dawks, in the late 90s and early 00s he was the one and only Dawks supporter at his primary school of about 800 kids. On footy day each month kids from one of the winning teams would get to sing their club theme song dressed in club colours at assembly. He had to do that solo, rarely given how ordinary they were through that period, but he did it from about Grade 2 onwards getting some extra support as the years progressed. He copped a heap of flack, of course that is what kids do, but he stuck to his guns and it didn't go unnoticed by the staff. By the time he was Grade 6 the school ended up making him sports captain.
Look who is laughing now!
Re: Winning isn't everything - malo - 05-16-2019
(05-15-2019, 07:09 AM)Baggers link Wrote:You're a funny one. What those 3 clubs were doing during those times was still win plenty of games... just not enough.
What does it matter if I or anyone, if supporting one of those clubs, would have called for a change of senior coach? Nothing. And no-one knows what would have happened had any of them changed their senior coach... might have improved, might have gone backwards, might have achieved about the same. We can speculate, but that means diddly. We just don't know, but what we do know is that they had a good base to launch from and should have been doing better - so those clubs, knowing this, each supported their senior coach in changing his MO and in some instances, some of the people around him with instant results... makes you wonder how much more successful they might have been had their senior coach changed his ways sooner? And to me that's the real message in this... expect success then when it doesn't come, look in the full-length mirror.
I think we're smart enough and not egocentric enough to simply agree to disagree. We see things differently and that doesn't reflect negatively or positively on anyone. And we each, from time to time, dare to speculate which can create some chaos. Difference is delicious. Be boring as all get-out if this forum was full of agreement!! In the end it boils down to how we disagree.
The difference with those 3 sides that Paul mentioned, I think, is that none of them went back to the beginning for an entire rebuild as we have done. I truly believe that we have to allow Bolton to at least have a shot at being able to coach the rebuilt side....Bringing in another bloke to coach a side that's ready made & them giving them credit for results is pretty skewed to be fair. It's like giving Ross Lyon credit for the Saints....or a little closer to home, Wallsy too much credit for building the 1986/87 sides (which were Parkins doing).
Anyway, I hope he gets another full year to fine tune a side that finally, has some significant upside.
Re: Winning isn't everything - flyboy77 - 05-16-2019
(05-15-2019, 11:50 PM)Lods link Wrote:That's a little sad...
But let him know there's change 'a comin'
I used to hate going to school after a Carlton loss...
Once or twice a year it gave the other kids an opportunity to have a shot at me.
Hopefully by the time he hits primary school his problem will be the same as the old days.
And in the days after the flags....well, for a few days you rule the school.
He may still have to hide his bottle....the other kids will want to pinch it.
I did remind him that CFC in the history of the game has won more premierships than anyone and that we'd very likely win another one before the likes of Essendon, Hawthorn, GWS, Melbourne, St Kilda and a good few others.
I have offered to get him a new water bottle all the same! ;D
Re: Winning isn't everything - PaulP - 05-16-2019
(05-16-2019, 12:02 AM)malo link Wrote:The difference with those 3 sides that Paul mentioned, I think, is that none of them went back to the beginning for an entire rebuild as we have done. I truly believe that we have to allow Bolton to at least have a shot at being able to coach the rebuilt side....Bringing in another bloke to coach a side that's ready made & them giving them credit for results is pretty skewed to be fair.........................
Anyway, I hope he gets another full year to fine tune a side that finally, has some significant upside.
I agree Mal, but it's not just the gouging of the list / extent of rebuild. It's about the clubs behind the teams. Those 3 among others are analytical and professional - they don't kow-tow to the whims of the media and certain supporter groups. They think and analyse properly, and then make good decisions. We could learn much from them. I hope we have learnt from them.
It's not about the past. It's about the future. We ran the Hawks to the wire, and apart from the siren and a couple of other issues, we could have won. This is the same Hawks team that completely dismantled and arrested the Giants only 2 weeks later - a much more heralded and fancied opponent.
Our blokes haven't won much recently, and yet still play with real spirit, with real vim and vigour. They are not the bad news Bears from decades ago. Getting them up and passionate and enthused after our last few years is a real credit to Bolton and co. In years gone past, the boys would have turned their toes up long ago.
Re: Winning isn't everything - Thryleon - 05-16-2019
If you want to see a coaching car wreck, mark neeld record is the one.
5 wins in 33 matches, 3 of which came against gws in their first two seasons and 1 against gold coast. 1 win against hirds bombers after their 2012 wheels fell off with plenty of big losses.
Re: Winning isn't everything - JonHenry - 05-16-2019
(05-16-2019, 01:28 AM)Thryleon link Wrote:If you want to see a coaching car wreck, mark neeld record is the one.
5 wins in 33 matches, 3 of which came against gws in their first two seasons and 1 against gold coast. 1 win against hirds bombers after their 2012 wheels fell off with plenty of big losses.
You realise we have won 4 games in 40 games?
On our list we have 4 pick 1's
A pick 2
2 x pick 3's
A pick 4
A pick 5
2 x pick 6's
2 x pick 10's
2 x pick 12's
2 x pick 13's
1 x pick 16
I don't think there is a bigger car wreck than us atm